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<blockquote data-quote="FormerlyHemlock" data-source="post: 6631889" data-attributes="member: 6787650">I think the primacy of offense only applies under specific conditions. If you want defensive strategies to compete with sniping and greatswords, try large numbers of durable foes like CR 1 giant ants in an adverse environment like darkness or cliffs. The thing about offensive strategies is that they're like fighting an avalanche with a fire hose: if you can stay ahead of input you're fine, but when input climbs everything suddenly fails at once. GWM is more failure-prone than SS because SS also lets you fight in rough terrain with lots of cover, which helps defense, but try fighting your way through a horde of 30 armored AC 16 kobolds every ten minutes&nbsp; for an hour and then tell me you wouldn't rather have a shield than a greatsword.Against AC 16, a DX 18 Fighter 8 with Archery does about 13 DPR using -5/+5 or 12 without. It's almost a complete waste of a half-feat. Crossbow Expert would boost you to 18ish instead. So I think if you go down this road, you'll make warlocks and crossbow fighters more attractive, but won't actually solve your problem of no one wanting to play defensive builds--you're just changed which offensive builds are best. If you want diverse characters you need to present diverse threat profiles. Fire breathing ants, man.Sent from my LS670 using Tapatalk 2</blockquote>

[QUOTE="FormerlyHemlock, post: 6631889, member: 6787650"] I think the primacy of offense only applies under specific conditions. If you want defensive strategies to compete with sniping and greatswords, try large numbers of durable foes like CR 1 giant ants in an adverse environment like darkness or cliffs. The thing about offensive strategies is that they're like fighting an avalanche with a fire hose: if you can stay ahead of input you're fine, but when input climbs everything suddenly fails at once. GWM is more failure-prone than SS because SS also lets you fight in rough terrain with lots of cover, which helps defense, but try fighting your way through a horde of 30 armored AC 16 kobolds every ten minutes for an hour and then tell me you wouldn't rather have a shield than a greatsword. Against AC 16, a DX 18 Fighter 8 with Archery does about 13 DPR using -5/+5 or 12 without. It's almost a complete waste of a half-feat. Crossbow Expert would boost you to 18ish instead. So I think if you go down this road, you'll make warlocks and crossbow fighters more attractive, but won't actually solve your problem of no one wanting to play defensive builds--you're just changed which offensive builds are best. If you want diverse characters you need to present diverse threat profiles. Fire breathing ants, man. Sent from my LS670 using Tapatalk 2 [/QUOTE]

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