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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 5563217" data-attributes="member: 42582">I initially posted this on <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/5562171-post12.html" target="_blank">a thread on the 4e board</a>, but thought it might be of more general interest. It's about framing mid-to-high level scenarios for D&D (or similar fantasy RPGs).In 4e, once PCs reach 11th level they take on a paragon path - the PCs in my 4e game are a Demonskin Adept, a Warpriest of Moradin, a Questing Knight, a Radiant Servant and a Divine Philosopher. Other Paragon Paths include being a Knight Commander, a Kensai or Swordmaster, etc. As the names of these paths indicate, they bring with them fictional elements as well as mechanical elements. It's a bit like an AD&D fighter reaching name level and becoming a Lord has consequences for the fiction - the fighter can now become a noble and attract men-at-arms to his/her castle - as well as mechanical consequences.Now Open Grave - the 4e undead sourcebook - has a fun little buried tower scenario called "Bloodtower on the Moorland", for 12th-level PCs. I've had a fondness for buried towers ever since Best of White Dwarf Scenarios 2, which has a mini-adventure in a tower buried in the desert, and I'm hoping to use this Open Grave one as part of the Vecna-cult plotline in my current game.But as presented, the scenario begins in this way:The PCs are visiting or passing through a city that lies near the moorland. While taking a meal at a local watering hole, they overhear a resident relating the following story.Now, what the hell is going on when 12-level PCs - Knight Commanders, Demonskin Adpets or whatever - are taking a meal at a local watering hole? As opposed to, for example, dining in the halls of the baron or the mayor! I regard this as yet another weakness in 4e adventure design - beside the inherent lameness of so many of the plot hooks, they tend to expressly contradict the game's default fictional content, which in relation to paragon tier PCs is as follows(PHB pp 28-29):In the paragon tier, your character is a shining example of heroism, set well apart from the masses.. . the fate of a nation or even the world might hang in the balance as you undertake momentous quests... When you face a dragon, it is a powerful adult who has established a lair and found its place in the world. Again, much like you.In my view shining examples of heroism, on whose deeds the fate of the world turns, who have found their places in the world and who are set well apart from the masses, don't start their quests in a local watering hole (absent special circumstances of the Aragorn variety). In my view it is this sort of bad adventure writing, as much as if not more than the mechanical design, that leads to the suggestion that there is no "progression" in 4e, and that as they level the PCs just go through the same dungeons with bigger numbers.(I should add: not all of 4e is like this. For example, the campaign arcs sketched in DMG2, the Planes Above and Below, Demonomicon and Underdark do show an awareness that changing tiers means changing the fiction in a way that matters to the play of the game.)Does anyone else feel the way I do about this? Or do some not mind a game in which name-level PCs are still wandering the gameworld from inn to inn, essentially anonymous mercenaries? How important is it that the framing of scenarios reflect the change in status that is implicit in at least some aspects of level gain? I don't think these are questions limited to 4e (for example, one purpose of settings like Sigil and Union seem to be to rationalise the continuation of this sort of play into upper levels), although they are probably more pressing in 4e because so much of the game is meant to take place at these mid-to-high levels.</blockquote>

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