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<blockquote data-quote="delericho" data-source="post: 5521841" data-attributes="member: 22424">Okay, consider this example.Let's take Bob. He's a 2nd level Fighter with a 20 Str, trained in Athletics, and with Skill Focus (Athletics) - a rare case, to be sure, but not impossible. He has a +14 Athletics modifier. His movement rate is 6. (8 on a Run)Now, we place him in the following situation:BXXXXXXXCCXXXXXTwhere B is Bob, T is his target, X represent normal squares of flooring, and C is a chasm.Bob wants to run towards his target, jump the chasm, and then charge.Is this an unreasonable thing to do? No. If the chasm wasn't there, he could do it easily. If the chasm were moved three squares in either direction, he could do it.It's not the distance that disallows it. That's fine.It's not the jump that disallows it. That's trivial. In fact, Bob's player doesn't even have to roll - the DC is 15, so he succeeds even on a '1'.The only reason it doesn't work is that Bob's Run action must end in mid-air, and he, strictly-speaking, cannot then avoid falling unless he's declared a &quot;double move&quot;/Run.But the thing is that the grid, 'squares', discrete 'actions', and even the characters turn as a whole are pure game artifacts. In a role-playing game, what happens on the grid is supposed to represent an actual character doing in an actual situation taking actual actions - it's not supposed to just be a playing piece on a board.So, yeah, it's idiotic.How about a nice, simple fix:&quot;If your jump ends in mid-air, you fall unless you immediately take some other action to prevent it. If your next action includes movement, you can continue your jump, provided your Athletics check result is high enough to do so.&quot;This covers the run-then-charge case, it covers a myriad of similar cases, and it even covers such things as &quot;I want to jump out there, and grab hold of the flying dragon so I don't fall&quot; - which, per RAW, is flat impossible.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="delericho, post: 5521841, member: 22424"] Okay, consider this example. Let's take Bob. He's a 2nd level Fighter with a 20 Str, trained in Athletics, and with Skill Focus (Athletics) - a rare case, to be sure, but not impossible. He has a +14 Athletics modifier. His movement rate is 6. (8 on a Run) Now, we place him in the following situation: BXXXXXXXCCXXXXXT where B is Bob, T is his target, X represent normal squares of flooring, and C is a chasm. Bob wants to run towards his target, jump the chasm, and then charge. Is this an unreasonable thing to do? No. If the chasm wasn't there, he could do it easily. If the chasm were moved three squares in either direction, he could do it. It's not the distance that disallows it. That's fine. It's not the jump that disallows it. That's trivial. In fact, Bob's player doesn't even have to roll - the DC is 15, so he succeeds even on a '1'. The only reason it doesn't work is that Bob's Run action [i]must[/i] end in mid-air, and he, strictly-speaking, cannot then avoid falling unless he's declared a "double move"/Run. But the thing is that the grid, 'squares', discrete 'actions', and even the characters turn as a whole are pure game artifacts. In a [i]role-playing[/i] game, what happens on the grid is supposed to represent an actual character doing in an actual situation taking actual actions - it's not supposed to just be a playing piece on a board. So, yeah, it's idiotic. How about a nice, simple fix: "If your jump ends in mid-air, you fall unless you immediately take some other action to prevent it. If your next action includes movement, you can continue your jump, provided your Athletics check result is high enough to do so." This covers the run-then-charge case, it covers a myriad of similar cases, and it even covers such things as "I want to jump out there, and grab hold of the flying dragon so I don't fall" - which, per RAW, is flat impossible. [/QUOTE]

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