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<blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 6023799" data-attributes="member: 4937"><p>Now there is a declaration likely to be somewhat contriversial. Given the time frame and the tiny number of surviving texts from the period I don't think it is at all conclusive in which direction the flow of information was going. And given that Zoroastrianism is emphaticly dualistic and Judaism is emphaticly monotheistic, I don't think you can make nearly so broad of claim as one giving the other a philosophical foundation. It is not at all certain which religion first codified its doctrine, and there is wild guesses as to the actual antiquity of both religions. (It's worth noting that by the internal evidence, Judaism claims to be older than Zoroastrianism.) It is just as likely that Judaism influenced Zoroaster's reforms of existing Vedic polytheism, as Zoroaster influenced Judiac philosophy. There is however no textual or archival evidence either way, although personally the more logical direction, given that Zoroaster demoted all other dieties in the Indo-Persian pantheon to the status of demons, is that Zoroaster is the one being influenced by introduction to the concept of monotheism (for parallels, see Mohammed's encounter with monotheism and the resulting challenge to and syncretism of Arabian polythiesm). Or, as wikipedia puts it, "Although these unifying notions deeply influenced the modernists of the late 19th and early 20th century, they have not fared well under the scrutiny of more recent interdisciplinary peer review. The study of pre-Islamic Iran has itself undergone a radical change in direction since the 1950s, and the field is today disinclined to speculation." </p><p></p><p>In other words, the so called 'scholars' were pulling things out of their hindparts, and you are repeating someone who is repeating someone whose knowledge was limited to the available evidence 60-100 years ago.</p><p></p><p>There simply is no textual or archaelogical evidence. Even the claim in wikipedia, "Most scholars believe that key concepts of Zoroastrian eschatology and demonology influenced the Abrahamic religions.", which is a much weaker (and therefore harder to disprove) assertion, turns out to rest on <em>the existance of documents from the 9th century AD.</em> If you actually go back to the documents from the 5th century BC, the eschatological concepts were much less developed and similar. It is therefore at least as likely that Zoroastrians were copying Abrahamic escatology as the other.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Celebrim, post: 6023799, member: 4937"] Now there is a declaration likely to be somewhat contriversial. Given the time frame and the tiny number of surviving texts from the period I don't think it is at all conclusive in which direction the flow of information was going. And given that Zoroastrianism is emphaticly dualistic and Judaism is emphaticly monotheistic, I don't think you can make nearly so broad of claim as one giving the other a philosophical foundation. It is not at all certain which religion first codified its doctrine, and there is wild guesses as to the actual antiquity of both religions. (It's worth noting that by the internal evidence, Judaism claims to be older than Zoroastrianism.) It is just as likely that Judaism influenced Zoroaster's reforms of existing Vedic polytheism, as Zoroaster influenced Judiac philosophy. There is however no textual or archival evidence either way, although personally the more logical direction, given that Zoroaster demoted all other dieties in the Indo-Persian pantheon to the status of demons, is that Zoroaster is the one being influenced by introduction to the concept of monotheism (for parallels, see Mohammed's encounter with monotheism and the resulting challenge to and syncretism of Arabian polythiesm). Or, as wikipedia puts it, "Although these unifying notions deeply influenced the modernists of the late 19th and early 20th century, they have not fared well under the scrutiny of more recent interdisciplinary peer review. The study of pre-Islamic Iran has itself undergone a radical change in direction since the 1950s, and the field is today disinclined to speculation." In other words, the so called 'scholars' were pulling things out of their hindparts, and you are repeating someone who is repeating someone whose knowledge was limited to the available evidence 60-100 years ago. There simply is no textual or archaelogical evidence. Even the claim in wikipedia, "Most scholars believe that key concepts of Zoroastrian eschatology and demonology influenced the Abrahamic religions.", which is a much weaker (and therefore harder to disprove) assertion, turns out to rest on [I]the existance of documents from the 9th century AD.[/I] If you actually go back to the documents from the 5th century BC, the eschatological concepts were much less developed and similar. It is therefore at least as likely that Zoroastrians were copying Abrahamic escatology as the other. [/QUOTE]
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