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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Pamphylian" data-source="post: 9749797" data-attributes="member: 7053769">Well put. I pick on 5e because I have the most experience with it and no experience with 2e-4e. The difference between 5e and earlier TSR versions seems to be the abruptness of the trivialization: it seems like early TSR editions introduced the counters to these subsystems either as the games progressed or at cost (like taking a more limited demihuman character) - which makes a little more sense. At a certain point, the cleric can take over making food, and their is no point in having a powerful wizard in the Vancian mold worrying about mundane things like the darkness of a cave. 5e seems to trivialize these things right out of the gate: either because the subsystems are directly self-trivializing (such as starvation), or because things like darkvision and light spells are so available and unassailable even at first level. My understanding is that many early edition tables ignored these things anyway (I wasn't around then!), but the systems were there in a reasonably functional way at early levels for DMs to use with effect. My preference for a modern D&D edition would be to not pick a lane. A modern edition of D&D is necessarily a compromise and should accommodate a few different genre's styles of play. Keep the "vestiges" of survival mechanics and simulationism as modular tools that if used are functional and impactful, but can be ignored by those that prefer otherwise.</blockquote>

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