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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ruin Explorer" data-source="post: 9751049" data-attributes="member: 18">Nah, they never are difficult, it's true, they're just boring. That's the thing. If you think a profoundly boring thing can be made interesting without massively reorienting the entire game in a way most players wouldn't be into, you have indeed played too much EU4 and "forgotten the face of your father", as it were.Yawn. Sorry but yawn. We can't live in some nerd from 1981's imagination forever. we're coming up on 40 years later dude. I loved Conan the Barbarian too but times change. And it's nowhere as iconic as you suggest, that's the the thing. Torches aren't this huge part of modern fantasy/adventure literature - most fantasy I've read in the last few decades (again we're talking multiple decades here, not ten years, not twenty, but more than that!) characters tend to use lanterns of various descriptions - mechanical/oil/gas, magical, bioluminescent (the most recent two fantasy novels I read are full of that, the main character is shocked when he encounters torches at one point, he's never really been around them before), and so on, or straight up use magic. The same is true for fantasy videogames. Even the Souls games and Elden Ring, which aggressively 1980s aesthetically (or use it as a jumping off point, anyway), pretty much immediately have you using a lantern (and/or magic).It's primarily a 1980s aesthetic. If anything, we need to go the other way and officialize more non-torch actual light sources that aren't magic. Hell, even 1989 when I started playing, only poor losers used torches. Everyone else had lanterns by like level 2 at the latest. Most people could afford them in chargen. We should give more fantastical fantasy options, rather than leaning into incredibly boring 1980s stuff.Hence no-one uses them. They're absolute rubbish and unneeded in D&D, because D&D isn't Shadowdark or w/e. People use lanterns or magic.This hasn't been true in any WotC edition, man. It's been 25 years of magical lighting from level 1. 25 years.</blockquote>

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