Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Sell me on Pathfinder!
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Kaisoku" data-source="post: 5319708" data-attributes="member: 58447"><p>System Mastery has been really well addressed I feel.</p><p></p><p>A lot of the "poor choices" in 3e have been addressed quite nicely:</p><p></p><p>- <strong>Skills!</strong> Between the consolidation and removal of the "4x at 1st level" business.. even if you find that you need something levels-down-the-road, you can pick up a skill concept fairly easily.</p><p>There's some hidden stuff too... Skill Focus increases at 10th level/ranks (+6 instead of +3), and the +2/+2 feats have a boost also (to +4/+4). A low/normal Wisdom Fighter wanting to be good at Perception, and having feats to spare, can easily catch up to someone with a class skill and decent wisdom.</p><p></p><p>- <strong>Feats!</strong> You get more, and faster (one every two levels), which means if you find yourself needing a feat from gameplay experience, you'll see it sooner. Fighters having the ability to retrain built into the core rules is nice too.</p><p>But not just that, as noted with the Skill feats, a lot of choices have been "bumped up" in bang for the buck. Toughness defaulting to +1/level, and the APG gives extended feat trees for some old feats much more worthwhile (like blind-fighting).</p><p></p><p>- <strong>Classes!</strong> The design intent of making classes valuable at all levels, especially the high levels, makes needing to multiclass or prestige out no longer necessary.</p><p>In fact, the design intent behind "PrCs are different choices, not power choices" can be seen with the APG's archetypes. Want a weapon master? Pick a weapon master fighter. Want a sniper? You've got a number of options between rogue talents, archetypes, and ranger options.</p><p>If you know the type of character you want to play right from the start, you can pick it... without needing to wait until an arbitrary 7th level with specific choices you apparently had to know about ahead of time.</p><p></p><p>- <strong>Game Mechanics!</strong> The size bonuses being drastically reduced, and streamlining of the Combat Maneuvers, has really let people test the waters for alternative tactics without needing to specialize to get <em>any</em> benefit. Note, it'll still be hard to grapple that colossal creature, but if grappling the BBEG so he can't set off his death machine seems like a good idea, you've at least got a <em>chance</em> these days, even if you didn't focus on the feats or builds.</p><p></p><p>I've found Pathfinder to be far more forgiving, and have a hard time finding a character choice that will always result in "a bad idea". Short of <em>weapon specialization (net),</em> of course. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /></p><p></p><p>There's still ways to optimize to get really <strong>really </strong>good at a specific thing. But if you don't, it's more likely to mean that you are more versatile, than down right useless like it tended to be in 3e.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Kaisoku, post: 5319708, member: 58447"] System Mastery has been really well addressed I feel. A lot of the "poor choices" in 3e have been addressed quite nicely: - [B]Skills![/B] Between the consolidation and removal of the "4x at 1st level" business.. even if you find that you need something levels-down-the-road, you can pick up a skill concept fairly easily. There's some hidden stuff too... Skill Focus increases at 10th level/ranks (+6 instead of +3), and the +2/+2 feats have a boost also (to +4/+4). A low/normal Wisdom Fighter wanting to be good at Perception, and having feats to spare, can easily catch up to someone with a class skill and decent wisdom. - [B]Feats![/B] You get more, and faster (one every two levels), which means if you find yourself needing a feat from gameplay experience, you'll see it sooner. Fighters having the ability to retrain built into the core rules is nice too. But not just that, as noted with the Skill feats, a lot of choices have been "bumped up" in bang for the buck. Toughness defaulting to +1/level, and the APG gives extended feat trees for some old feats much more worthwhile (like blind-fighting). - [B]Classes![/B] The design intent of making classes valuable at all levels, especially the high levels, makes needing to multiclass or prestige out no longer necessary. In fact, the design intent behind "PrCs are different choices, not power choices" can be seen with the APG's archetypes. Want a weapon master? Pick a weapon master fighter. Want a sniper? You've got a number of options between rogue talents, archetypes, and ranger options. If you know the type of character you want to play right from the start, you can pick it... without needing to wait until an arbitrary 7th level with specific choices you apparently had to know about ahead of time. - [B]Game Mechanics![/B] The size bonuses being drastically reduced, and streamlining of the Combat Maneuvers, has really let people test the waters for alternative tactics without needing to specialize to get [I]any[/I] benefit. Note, it'll still be hard to grapple that colossal creature, but if grappling the BBEG so he can't set off his death machine seems like a good idea, you've at least got a [I]chance[/I] these days, even if you didn't focus on the feats or builds. I've found Pathfinder to be far more forgiving, and have a hard time finding a character choice that will always result in "a bad idea". Short of [I]weapon specialization (net),[/I] of course. ;) There's still ways to optimize to get really [B]really [/B]good at a specific thing. But if you don't, it's more likely to mean that you are more versatile, than down right useless like it tended to be in 3e. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Sell me on Pathfinder!
Top