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Message: <blockquote data-quote="chilibean" data-source="post: 109836" data-attributes="member: 2220">Ever since I bought the Oriental Adventures book, the additional uses for sense motive have been bothering me.  We started using them in our games and the effect seemed weird.Now we can figure out the level of an opponent with a DC 15, and their full attack & damage bonus with a DC of 25.  It struck me as odd when our rogue glanced at an evil cleric in RttTEE and knew right away that she was only level X, so he decided to attack the enemy wizard which was level Y.So it took 1 glance from across the room to figure out the enemies total level, but after he swung and hit that wizard in melee he still had only a vague idea of what AC he had (lower than what he rolled).What would a fair DC be for determining an opponents AC?What modifier would you put if they wore a robe over their armor?Would you have to see them move in combat before you could guess their dex bonus?  If not, would seeing that give you a circumstance bonus?What if you watched them in combat for a round with someone else?Why would a high level fighter be so weak in sizing up his opponents (ie. why is this not a class skill)?Rangers and Druids seem pretty strong in this if you allow an Wilderness Lore check to determine these things for wildernessy type creatures, but it would seem that only a cleric would be able to size up another cleric really well.  Of course, a rogue would probably be skilled at sizing up anyone.Why would a wizard be able to figure out the attack bonus of a fighter with the same DC as another fighter?  Why would a fighter be able to figure out the level of a wizard at all?If you play D&D as something other than simply hack and slash, it becomes VERY important to be able to size up your situation.  If the DM knows the only action that will happen upon meeting someone is an initiave roll followed by an attack, then I guess it's no big deal because your only going to run into things you have a chance to defeat.As a side note (probably for the house rules forum), what the game seems to be lacking is a mechanic for this to take the burden off the DM to constantly create creative and inspired ways of describing the opponents you meet.  Obviously, the intent of the game is to 'role-play' this, but for the people who are more talented in 'roll-playing' than 'role-playing' a better defined game mechanic seems to be in order.</blockquote>

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