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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mythmere1" data-source="post: 2138461" data-attributes="member: 26563">I'm in the "it's the system" camp.  I can't isolate all of it, but one element is the way magic is portrayed as a fairly complete system.  Earlier editions (with this reducing in each one) treated magic in the Vancian manner that wizards were using formulae from the small part of magic that they could grasp, and that a vast pattern of magical power was out there, completely unknown and full of pitfalls for the unwary practitioner.  There was no actual rules provision for these pitfalls, but the "unknown pattern" flavor gave the DM a free hand to use magic as a backdrop or a device without a wizard being able to gain too much knowledge about it, or know precisely how to counter it.  I've been playing Castles & Crusades by preference for the last couple of months, and it's got more of the old school flavor of magic.It's only one example, but magic is such a central part of a fantasy game that I think this a relevant one.  It's too sanitized, too complete, too much of a tool.And the rulebooks aren't fun reading.  That's a bigger deal than I would have thought until I started in with the C&C stuff.</blockquote>