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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Umbran" data-source="post: 896027" data-attributes="member: 177">Okay, then to turn the tables, if you're allowed to gloss over the mature underpinnings of violence and call it action, why can't someone else do the same for sexual game content?  At the core, they are both "mature" themes, so they should be open to similar treatment, no?You say "People want romance to be realistic.."  Really?  Finally, something in which the entire population of the planet wants the same exact thing?  Wow!  That's a breakthrough!  The UN will love this unity...!Somehow, I think it's more that some folk want realistic romance, some want unrealistic, storybook romance, and others just want kinky stuff. Well, we're pretty darned close to agreement.  I'd happily say that well done romance transcends rules, rather than defies them.RPGs have a basic problem of trying to represent things the player cannot do that the character can.  We find this simple and easy to do with physical models for combat and such.  We find it much more problematic for social interaction.  Some folks don't use the social skills at all, some rely on the dice entirely, and many lie somewhere inbetween.I, personally don't begrudge someone else the opportunity to experiement with rules systems to aid in their romance stories.  If it works for them, cool.    I'm also impressed with P-cat and CM.  Perhaps they should get together and write some stuff on game romance?  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />  (I can hear KidCthulhu laughing as we speak) Yeah, well, my point is largely that everyone is arguing from a position of ignorance (my ability to come up with so many plausible counter-arguments based upon speculation of what might be is supposed to illustrate the point), and that they should stop and wait for the book.  Okay, misread on my part, then.  Seemed to me that you had a bit more emotional involvment than that.  My apologies.Or maybe I didn't misread, as I don't suppose you'd start casting more personal remarks unless you were emoionally involved in the topic.I'm not interested in the book itself.  I'm interested in gaming products getting a fair shake.  Let the thing speak for itself.  I'd expect you, as someone in the industry, to support that.  Or would you prefer that some other respected industry professional start saying stuff that might prejudice the buyers against your work before it was even published?  (Okay, you really don't deserve this next bit, but I think the image involved is funny, and it is at least slightly illustrative...)---------------Or, maybe gaming will turn into something like professional wrestling, with lots of trash talk?[Announcer Voice]  In this corner, we have the reigning champion, Monte Cook, defending his title, "The Book of Vile Darkness"!  In the opposing corner, we have Tracy Hickman, master of the Dragonlance!  Now, remember men, we want a nice, dirty fight. Lots of hitting below the belt!  When you hear the bell, come out swinging![/Announcer Voice]---------------I'm not interested in "marginalizing" anything.  Any discussion about what the book containsis in ignorance unless you've got a hold of a copy before the rest of us.  Fear?  Well, correct me if I'm wrong, but just after this you seem to voice a concern about the book encouraging bad DMing.  Isn't that a fear?  Okay, if that's your honest curiosity, cool.  It just seemed to me that you were putting a lot of more energy into putting down the idea that the rulebook could be useful than putting forth a bit of idle curiosity.  I'll admit to a rather strong knee-jerk response of "let the book speak for itself when it comes out".  There are worse sins for me to commit, I think.</blockquote>

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