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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 6205604" data-attributes="member: 4937">First, the goal is never to send anyone packing forever.  Secondly, judged as a practical action, what you've suggested at best buys the group some time.  I've said before that if I had one player being a jerk to another player, it was something I'd have to deal with.   I've never had to deal with this particular problem, but yeah, this is a pull the player aside at the end of the session and say, "What the heck, Bob?" sort of moment.  "How about we not act like a jerk toward the new player, k?"  And conversely, "I apologize for Bob's behavior Sue.  That was uncalled for and I'm going to talk to him about it."  But there is a very strong possibility that me coming down on Bob, especially if I do it public like isn't going to have the effect you think.  a) Bob could now be jealous of Sue.  Do you like Sue more than me?  Is that why you are favoring them?b) Bob could see the fact that I've intervened on Sue's behalf, proof she's a weak link.  Why do you need to protect Sue?  That's just what I thought she'd do - run to daddy GM for protection.   Boo hoo.c) The other players may side with Bob.  Look, we all got along before Sue came along.  Clearly Sue just doesn't fit in this group.  It's not that she's a woman or anything, it's just she just doesn't really have the right personality.And you know, I don't know whether the odds are higher of all this happening if Sue is a woman, but I can tell you that its a pretty normal human dynamic even if it is a boy named Sue.  It certainly doesn't happen all the time (thank God), but it's the way I've seen people behave. At best, if Bob really is being a problem my siding with Sue is just buying some time.   Ultimately Sue still needs to convince Bob she brings value to the group, and the only way to do that is .... bring value to the group.   Then whatever was motivating Bob's dislike of Sue, hopefully we get a new Bob that says, "Wow, X really can bring value to the group."   One person.  One relationship at a time. +1 geek point to you. For example, contrition: Do you are do you not think that contrition was cited as the major reason a gaming company or group should receive our support if they were attacked?   Read the original essay again.  My problem with that is that there was no defined standard other than, "Someone was offended."  I asked for a particular standard, "Would my romanticized African Kingdom meet your standard of 'noble savage', or am I now in the damnable category of the non-contrite content creator?  How can I avoid earning your outrage in the first place, if defending my creation is not an acceptable act on my part?"For example, diversity: And so forth.  I think it odd that you claim "contrition", "diversity", and "sensitivity" are topics I introduced to this discussion.I have very strong feelings that it is a bad idea to view the world through the framework of 'isms', yes.I'd like to think I'd give everyone my every consideration.  But put in a less snarky light, that's not entirely a bad idea.  I mean if you really think that's the dynamic that is going on, you might be surprised about how a frank question throws it into light: "I'm getting the feeling you don't want me here.  I really want to play this game.  May I?"   If there is any chance of the two of you playing together at all, maybe you'll embarrass him into acting decent.  If the answer is "No.", well then at least you've got that out on the table.  Or maybe go the other way and throw some flattery at the idiot, "Really?  You've been playing since the '70s?  What was it like back in the day?  Did you ever meet Gygax?"  There is every reason to not act in the way a jerk expects you to.I disagree.Because I'd like to think that I would.  How many times have I told this board, you can't chase me away by getting angry or calling me an idiot.   I can deal with your honest emotion.  The only thing you can really do to belittle me is not take me seriously, or persistently misquote me, or be dishonest, or otherwise disengage from me.  So tell me about your triumphs.  How did you go about winning acceptance?  How did you get your foot in the door?  How did you change people's minds?   That's far more value than any politically charged essay.And you know, the story of how you called security on this jerk and had him removed from the convention.  That's a tragedy.  Even if it had to happen, even if the jerk left you know other choice because he'd become threatening, I feel sorry for everyone involved.</blockquote>

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