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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Drifter Bob" data-source="post: 1670647" data-attributes="member: 17723">You are correct in all of this, my point is indeed that the precursors of Greek religion go way, way back.  One specific very strong influence appears to be the so called "minoan" society of Crete and Thera which ended around 14th century BC.  This society was very influential on Mycenian society, itself the precursor of the Greece we know so well.  Many greek gods including for example poseidon and bacchus are traced to Crete by quite sober historians.  It is also widely recognized in academia that something much closer to a gender equality than you saw in Greece.  (maybe thats why they appear to have been comfortable enough to walk around topless <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> )Similarly, barbarian cultures to the north and west of Greece were much more egalitarian between sexes (and in other ways) including the Celts and Scythians, both of whom had well documented female warriors.According to Herodotus, succumbing to Persian overlordship was not considered as bad is it may sound to modern ears.  Many formerly powerful greek islands and cities had been under nominal Persian control for years, and in fact the bulk of the Persian navy at Salamis was Greek.Many historians also point out that the idea of Greece as a unified society let alone a state was foreign at the time.  Generally the Greeks hated each other at least as much as any outsider.Finally, Herodutus is not the only ancient historian who seems to feel that the issue was definately up in the air, and that it was a difficult decision.  I agree 100% if you had any idea who you were discussing this with you would know I'm about the furthest thing possible from PC.  PC and bogus historical revisionism is not only the egalitarian liberal variety, incidentally (I hate every form, right or left wing)Actually, I remember at least one Fafhred and Gray Mouser story, I think it was called "The best thieves in lankhmar" where they were totally scammed and duped by a pair of rival thieves, who were females...DB</blockquote>

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