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Shifting when not adjacent?
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<blockquote data-quote="Zaruthustran" data-source="post: 4392073" data-attributes="member: 1457"><p>You've got a lot of the pieces identified, but I think you're putting them together incorrectly. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Polearm Gamble allows an OA, and OAs interrupt. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>This is the heart of your confusion. You're defining a "regular OA", and there's no such thing. </p><p></p><p>OAs are a type of action. They're defined on page 268, 269, and 290. The rules on 290 are most detailed for Opportunity Attacks specifically. There are six bullet points. Points 1, 3, 4, 5, and 6 are rules. Points 2 and 3 are two common triggers. Point 7 is a common exception. </p><p></p><p>It's important to distinguish the triggers from the action called "Opportunity Attack". All OAs require <u>a</u> trigger, but OAs don't really care what that trigger <u>is</u>. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>This is just plain wrong. OAs interrupt. They are not immediate actions, and therefore are neither "reactions" nor "interrupts". They're an opportunity action that interrupts. See page 268.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>The trigger is met, and the OA is initiated as you describe. But since the target's triggering action is interrupted (point 6 of page 290), and therefore still 4 squares away, the OA aborts because it doesn't satisfy the rule "able to attack" (point 5 of page 290). The attack cannot take place after the target arrives in the adjacent square, because by that time the trigger has passed (the OA would no longer be interrupting, and therefore does not satisfy point 6 of page 290). </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Again, there is no such thing as "normal" OA. There are two common triggers for OA, true, but any trigger will do. The important things to consider are the rules for OAs, explained in points 1, 3, 4, 5, and 6 of page 290.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Forced Movement is addressed on page 268, and point 4 specifically says that Forced Movement does not provoke OAs or other opportunity actions. There's your answer. All Polearm Gamble does is grant a new trigger for OAs; it doesn't change the rules of OAs or nullify the rules for Forced Movement.</p><p></p><p>When considering any OA and how the rules interact, I've found it helpful to begin by replacing whatever particular trigger is up for debate with a generic variable [OA TRIGGER], and then just follow the rules. </p><p></p><p>So for purposes of discussion, the text for Polearm Gamble looks like this: "[OA TRIGGER], you can make an opportunity attack with a polearm against that enemy, but you grant combat advantage to that enemy until the end of the enemy’s turn."</p><p></p><p>You just treat the trigger like any other trigger. After you grok that, you can look at the specific trigger, and simply follow the rules of OAs from the bullet list on p290:</p><p></p><p>1. Basic melee attack</p><p>3. One per combatant's turn</p><p>4. Able to attack</p><p>5. Interrupt's other's action</p><p></p><p>So for Polearm Gamble, two scenarios. Scenario 1 is teleporting. Scenario 2 is moving to an adjacent square. Polearm Gambler is human armed with glaive.</p><p></p><p>Scenario 1: teleport into adjacent square from 4 squares away</p><p>1. Basic melee attack. Okay, that's fine.</p><p>3. One per combatant's turn. We'll assume we haven't yet taken an OA.</p><p>4. Able to attack. At the time the OA is triggered the enemy is 4 squares away, so we are unable to make an attack.</p><p>5. Interrupt's other's action. The trigger is "enter an adjacent square", so that's what we interrupt. At the time of the interrupt the enemy is 4 squares away. See point 4.</p><p></p><p>Conclusion 1: OA fails to go off.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Scenario 2: move into adjacent square from 4 squares away</p><p>1. Basic melee attack. Okay, that's fine.</p><p>3. One per combatant's turn. We'll assume we haven't yet taken an OA.</p><p>4. Able to attack. At the time the OA is triggered the enemy is 2 squares away, and reach allows us to attack 2 squares away. We are able to make an attack.</p><p>5. Interrupt's other's action. The trigger is "enter an adjacent square", so that's the action we interrupt. At the time of the interrupt the enemy is 2 squares away. See point 4.</p><p></p><p>Conclusion 2: OA goes off when enemy is 2 squares away.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Zaruthustran, post: 4392073, member: 1457"] You've got a lot of the pieces identified, but I think you're putting them together incorrectly. Polearm Gamble allows an OA, and OAs interrupt. This is the heart of your confusion. You're defining a "regular OA", and there's no such thing. OAs are a type of action. They're defined on page 268, 269, and 290. The rules on 290 are most detailed for Opportunity Attacks specifically. There are six bullet points. Points 1, 3, 4, 5, and 6 are rules. Points 2 and 3 are two common triggers. Point 7 is a common exception. It's important to distinguish the triggers from the action called "Opportunity Attack". All OAs require [u]a[/u] trigger, but OAs don't really care what that trigger [u]is[/u]. This is just plain wrong. OAs interrupt. They are not immediate actions, and therefore are neither "reactions" nor "interrupts". They're an opportunity action that interrupts. See page 268. The trigger is met, and the OA is initiated as you describe. But since the target's triggering action is interrupted (point 6 of page 290), and therefore still 4 squares away, the OA aborts because it doesn't satisfy the rule "able to attack" (point 5 of page 290). The attack cannot take place after the target arrives in the adjacent square, because by that time the trigger has passed (the OA would no longer be interrupting, and therefore does not satisfy point 6 of page 290). Again, there is no such thing as "normal" OA. There are two common triggers for OA, true, but any trigger will do. The important things to consider are the rules for OAs, explained in points 1, 3, 4, 5, and 6 of page 290. Forced Movement is addressed on page 268, and point 4 specifically says that Forced Movement does not provoke OAs or other opportunity actions. There's your answer. All Polearm Gamble does is grant a new trigger for OAs; it doesn't change the rules of OAs or nullify the rules for Forced Movement. When considering any OA and how the rules interact, I've found it helpful to begin by replacing whatever particular trigger is up for debate with a generic variable [OA TRIGGER], and then just follow the rules. So for purposes of discussion, the text for Polearm Gamble looks like this: "[OA TRIGGER], you can make an opportunity attack with a polearm against that enemy, but you grant combat advantage to that enemy until the end of the enemy’s turn." You just treat the trigger like any other trigger. After you grok that, you can look at the specific trigger, and simply follow the rules of OAs from the bullet list on p290: 1. Basic melee attack 3. One per combatant's turn 4. Able to attack 5. Interrupt's other's action So for Polearm Gamble, two scenarios. Scenario 1 is teleporting. Scenario 2 is moving to an adjacent square. Polearm Gambler is human armed with glaive. Scenario 1: teleport into adjacent square from 4 squares away 1. Basic melee attack. Okay, that's fine. 3. One per combatant's turn. We'll assume we haven't yet taken an OA. 4. Able to attack. At the time the OA is triggered the enemy is 4 squares away, so we are unable to make an attack. 5. Interrupt's other's action. The trigger is "enter an adjacent square", so that's what we interrupt. At the time of the interrupt the enemy is 4 squares away. See point 4. Conclusion 1: OA fails to go off. Scenario 2: move into adjacent square from 4 squares away 1. Basic melee attack. Okay, that's fine. 3. One per combatant's turn. We'll assume we haven't yet taken an OA. 4. Able to attack. At the time the OA is triggered the enemy is 2 squares away, and reach allows us to attack 2 squares away. We are able to make an attack. 5. Interrupt's other's action. The trigger is "enter an adjacent square", so that's the action we interrupt. At the time of the interrupt the enemy is 2 squares away. See point 4. Conclusion 2: OA goes off when enemy is 2 squares away. [/QUOTE]
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