Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="James Gasik" data-source="post: 9504770" data-attributes="member: 6877472">If the point of the Rogue is to just have a character who automatically succeeds at certain skill checks, it occurs to me that they are overtuned in this regard.&nbsp; By the final Tier of play, Expertise could allow for a +17(!) bonus to a check (or higher, in theory- you could get a Dexterity above 20, or the ioun stone that increases your proficiency bonus by 1, which would become another +2), which, combined with guidance, help action, bardic inspiration, advantage, and so forth, would allow the Rogue to make checks beyond impossible.You could be succeeding at DC 30 checks long before this point, of course.&nbsp; One of the frequent complaints about 5e is that the exploration and social pillars of play are basically vestigial, and a lot of these sorts of challenges are based on checks (in my experience).&nbsp; Can you open the door, climb the wall, avoid the trap, decipher arcane runes of power, survive on an outer plane, or convince the king to lend you his army?The ability to just automatically succeed at these tasks potentially does more to harm the non-combat portion of play than things like goodberry.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="James Gasik, post: 9504770, member: 6877472"] If the point of the Rogue is to just have a character who automatically succeeds at certain skill checks, it occurs to me that they are overtuned in this regard. By the final Tier of play, Expertise could allow for a +17(!) bonus to a check (or higher, in theory- you could get a Dexterity above 20, or the [I]ioun stone[/I] that increases your proficiency bonus by 1, which would become another +2), which, combined with guidance, help action, bardic inspiration, advantage, and so forth, would allow the Rogue to make checks beyond impossible. You could be succeeding at DC 30 checks long before this point, of course. One of the frequent complaints about 5e is that the exploration and social pillars of play are basically vestigial, and a lot of these sorts of challenges are based on checks (in my experience). Can you open the door, climb the wall, avoid the trap, decipher arcane runes of power, survive on an outer plane, or convince the king to lend you his army? The ability to just automatically succeed at these tasks potentially does more to harm the non-combat portion of play than things like [I]goodberry[/I]. [/QUOTE]

Verification