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<blockquote data-quote="DEFCON 1" data-source="post: 9505948" data-attributes="member: 7006">Unless I'm reading you incorrectly (which is entirely possible I will admit)... you make it sound like your reasons for these checks are to think up ways in the fiction to generate bonus methods to &quot;win the dice roll&quot;.&nbsp; That &quot;winning the dice roll&quot; is actually the point of playing, and not whatever it is your character is actually doing and trying to accomplish &quot;in-game&quot; in the world of the campaign.&nbsp; If your PC has to &quot;get over a wall&quot; within the fiction (for example), then the point of the RPG is to leverage game mechanics and think up methods within the fiction that allow you to get mechanical bonuses to win the dice roll that lets you &quot;get over the wall&quot;.&nbsp; And if you &quot;get over the wall&quot; then you've won this encounter... not because your character now gets to see what is on the other side, but merely because you rolled higher than the DC the DM gave you.Now personally, I don't really see a point in that circle of gameplay for an RPG (playing a dice and puzzle game that dresses up the individual rolls with a fantasy veneer), so I'm wondering if perhaps I am misinterpreting what you are talking about (which is quite possible)?&nbsp; Or if I'm in fact correct in my interpretation of your reasoning, then it means your decisions for choosing to play an RPG are wildly different than mine (also quite possible).&nbsp; And while I can appreciate the difference, I can also understand why the designers might not design the game towards your direction if they feel the point of playing D&amp;D (rather than some other dice game) is more in the direction of mine.The game can absolutely play the way it seems like you are advocating for... and it very much feels reflective of late '70s style gameplay (where the challenge is to the players to outwit the DM by leveraging bits of fiction)... but that style has moved on quite a ways over the last 50 years and I don't foresee &quot;official&quot; D&amp;D ever going back to it.&nbsp; Especially not now that there are plenty of RPGs that are being designed all the time to bring that style back for the players that want it.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="DEFCON 1, post: 9505948, member: 7006"] Unless I'm reading you incorrectly (which is entirely possible I will admit)... you make it sound like your reasons for these checks are to think up ways in the fiction to generate bonus methods to "win the dice roll". That "winning the dice roll" is actually the point of playing, and not whatever it is your character is actually doing and trying to accomplish "in-game" in the world of the campaign. If your PC has to "get over a wall" within the fiction (for example), then the point of the RPG is to leverage game mechanics and think up methods within the fiction that allow you to get mechanical bonuses to win the dice roll that lets you "get over the wall". And if you "get over the wall" then you've won this encounter... not because your character now gets to see what is on the other side, but merely because you rolled higher than the DC the DM gave you. Now personally, I don't really see a point in that circle of gameplay for an RPG (playing a dice and puzzle game that dresses up the individual rolls with a fantasy veneer), so I'm wondering if perhaps I am misinterpreting what you are talking about (which is quite possible)? Or if I'm in fact correct in my interpretation of your reasoning, then it means your decisions for choosing to play an RPG are wildly different than mine (also quite possible). And while I can appreciate the difference, I can also understand why the designers might not design the game towards your direction if they feel the point of playing D&D (rather than some other dice game) is more in the direction of mine. The game can absolutely play the way it seems like you are advocating for... and it very much feels reflective of late '70s style gameplay (where the challenge is to the players to outwit the DM by leveraging bits of fiction)... but that style has moved on quite a ways over the last 50 years and I don't foresee "official" D&D ever going back to it. Especially not now that there are plenty of RPGs that are being designed all the time to bring that style back for the players that want it. [/QUOTE]

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