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General Tabletop Discussion
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Should D&D 5e have Epic Levels?
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<blockquote data-quote="dave2008" data-source="post: 8026194" data-attributes="member: 83242"><p>Not IME, but we are only lvl 15. We did do a couple 20th lvl one shot adventures and they went quite well, but it has been about 4+ years so my memory is a bit foggy.</p><p>I never use CR. We didn't have it in 1e and I don't need it in 5e. I just design the encounter that makes sense. It is the players job to figure out how to deal with it.</p><p> Not really something I have had to worry about. I've always been able to challenge my players. Not sure how to help you there, it seems easy to me (but my players are not power gamers / optimizers).</p><p>OK, it that is your problem simply buff ACs and saves. I have a hard time believing you couldn't solve that one.</p><p></p><p> As noted above, it is pretty easy to buff saves and ACs. Heck, I feel this really should have been included in the DMG. Something like: "Increase monster ACs and saves by 1 per tier" (epic being tier 5 & 6 if it is 10 more levels). So all epic monsters would get a +5 or 6 to every save and AC. So now your ancient red dragon has an AC 28. That works well enough.</p><p> I don't know, but based on the trend in the PHB, I could see two 8th lvl spells at 22, two 9th lvl spells at 25, and one 10th lvl spell at 30. That seems fine to me. Still less spells than 3e I believe.</p><p> There a lots of ways you can do it. Personally I use a version of the swarm rules to create hordes or regiments of monsters. However, it is worth noting that at lvl 20 PCs can already deal more than 100DPR, so even CR 10ish monsters are going to be pretty mooky without any changes.</p><p></p><p>Could be, but it doesn't have to be. Also, just because you can't or don't want to handle the added complexity of epic level battles isn't a good reason to deny those you can or want to. Not every type of game is for everyone.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="dave2008, post: 8026194, member: 83242"] Not IME, but we are only lvl 15. We did do a couple 20th lvl one shot adventures and they went quite well, but it has been about 4+ years so my memory is a bit foggy. I never use CR. We didn't have it in 1e and I don't need it in 5e. I just design the encounter that makes sense. It is the players job to figure out how to deal with it. Not really something I have had to worry about. I've always been able to challenge my players. Not sure how to help you there, it seems easy to me (but my players are not power gamers / optimizers). OK, it that is your problem simply buff ACs and saves. I have a hard time believing you couldn't solve that one. As noted above, it is pretty easy to buff saves and ACs. Heck, I feel this really should have been included in the DMG. Something like: "Increase monster ACs and saves by 1 per tier" (epic being tier 5 & 6 if it is 10 more levels). So all epic monsters would get a +5 or 6 to every save and AC. So now your ancient red dragon has an AC 28. That works well enough. I don't know, but based on the trend in the PHB, I could see two 8th lvl spells at 22, two 9th lvl spells at 25, and one 10th lvl spell at 30. That seems fine to me. Still less spells than 3e I believe. There a lots of ways you can do it. Personally I use a version of the swarm rules to create hordes or regiments of monsters. However, it is worth noting that at lvl 20 PCs can already deal more than 100DPR, so even CR 10ish monsters are going to be pretty mooky without any changes. Could be, but it doesn't have to be. Also, just because you can't or don't want to handle the added complexity of epic level battles isn't a good reason to deny those you can or want to. Not every type of game is for everyone. [/QUOTE]
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