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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Sunseeker" data-source="post: 6281653">As a long time MTG player, I have to agree that there is much in 4e that is modeled after the way MTG works, at least in terms of style and design sense.  "Attacking" against "Defenses" is certainly straight from the MTG Power/Toughness playbook, as opposed to reacting to attacks with defensive rolls.  I really like both options and I feel they each have a place in D&D depending on the attack and the method of defense.  I incorporate both in my games.It's not unknown that while the D&D market is shrinking, MTG maintains a strong playerbase, and this is most certainly in part to the fact that there have been few major changes to the rules over the years.  New "editions" aren't whole new games, they're new settings.  With some irony, Wizards uses the same model with MTG as Paizo does with Pathfinder.  Fixed core, and strong adventure support and adding new rules and systems to the game, which only apply when players choose to play a card with the associated rules.I think 4e was trying to be that core on to which the game could expand in non-splat, non-crunch ways.  This is an admirable goal.  Unfortunately it already had 3+ editions trying to be the same thing to compete with.But D&D isn't a CCG and it can't be sold like one.  There's no incentive to buy the latest books like there is to buy the latest cards.  You don't even need the official books to play in organized play, while you do need to have the official cards for sanctioned MTG play.  The minis tried to fill that "you need to buy it in order to play" gap, but really they simply weren't the same thing.  Even if you wanted to play with Minis, there's absolutely no incentive to have the "official" ones, even for sanctioned play.  I think there are cues to be taken from MTG.  At it's core MTG uses a very simple and streamlined rules system of basic math (it is extremely rare to find multiplication or division in MTG, or any math of a more complicated sort) and a system of "can't trumps can", which as again, a long time MTG player, I find is very easy to comprehend, especially for people new to the game, it is the sort of system that can be laid in place as a foundation for a lot of new rules and systems down the road.</blockquote>

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