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General Tabletop Discussion
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Should Intuition be a skill/ability?
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<blockquote data-quote="iserith" data-source="post: 7923659" data-attributes="member: 97077"><p>I <a href="https://www.enworld.org/threads/should-intuition-be-a-skill-ability.670410/post-7923517" target="_blank">said this already above</a>.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>"Passive" refers to the fact that there are no dice. An ability check requires that the PC be undertaking a task that has an uncertain outcome and a meaningful consequence for failure. A passive check is a special kind of ability check. A PC can engage in the task of breathing. If that task has an uncertain outcome and a meaningful consequence for failure, then an ability check is called for. Much like staying alert to hidden dangers, most DMs and players agree to assume the PCs are breathing without it being said until it matters (such as in a cloud of knockout gas).</p><p></p><p>A death save is a saving throw and therefore generally involuntary; it is not an ability check.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>The game is not a simulation of reality, so these sorts of arguments fall flat in my view. Passive checks are a defined mechanic in the game. They are what the rules say they are. The rules don't delineate between actively or passively performing a task. You just perform tasks and those tasks may be resolved by the DM saying you succeed or fail or either of those outcomes preceded by an ability check, which may be a passive check.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>D&D 5e game defines roleplaying as "...<em>you </em>as a player determining how your character thinks, acts, and talks." It goes on to say "Roleplaying is part of every aspect of the game..." and goes on to explain active and descriptive roleplaying. There is no support in the game for the DM doing this for the players with the exception of the magical compulsion or the like. A DM doing this is stepping outside of the prescribed role for DM. Whether that is seen as a good or bad thing or both will vary.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I think you'd have a lot of work to do to prove that a character's thoughts and feelings are part of the DM's duty to describe the environment in the way the game intends. Whether you think it's okay for a DM to step outside of his or her role and into the players' role or vice versa is up to you and your players. I would suggest it's not necessary and can be problematic. Something that adds nothing and could cause problems is not a good tool in my opinion.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>There is nothing in this discussion, nor most D&D discussions, that I have not already tried. Not surprisingly, the things that are supported by the game itself seem to work better in my experience than things that are not.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Feelings: an emotional state or reaction.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>My mind is open to the fact that people play the game in different ways. It would be for you to tell me, if you want, why you think the method in which the DM steps out of his or her role and into the player role is desirable. So far as I can tell, you just think that's part of describing the environment, when that's not supported by the game at all. I'd also like to hear how you think your game would be impacted if you just stopped doing it altogether.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Agreed. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f44d.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt="(y)" title="Thumbs up (y)" data-smilie="22"data-shortname="(y)" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="iserith, post: 7923659, member: 97077"] I [URL='https://www.enworld.org/threads/should-intuition-be-a-skill-ability.670410/post-7923517']said this already above[/URL]. "Passive" refers to the fact that there are no dice. An ability check requires that the PC be undertaking a task that has an uncertain outcome and a meaningful consequence for failure. A passive check is a special kind of ability check. A PC can engage in the task of breathing. If that task has an uncertain outcome and a meaningful consequence for failure, then an ability check is called for. Much like staying alert to hidden dangers, most DMs and players agree to assume the PCs are breathing without it being said until it matters (such as in a cloud of knockout gas). A death save is a saving throw and therefore generally involuntary; it is not an ability check. The game is not a simulation of reality, so these sorts of arguments fall flat in my view. Passive checks are a defined mechanic in the game. They are what the rules say they are. The rules don't delineate between actively or passively performing a task. You just perform tasks and those tasks may be resolved by the DM saying you succeed or fail or either of those outcomes preceded by an ability check, which may be a passive check. D&D 5e game defines roleplaying as "...[I]you [/I]as a player determining how your character thinks, acts, and talks." It goes on to say "Roleplaying is part of every aspect of the game..." and goes on to explain active and descriptive roleplaying. There is no support in the game for the DM doing this for the players with the exception of the magical compulsion or the like. A DM doing this is stepping outside of the prescribed role for DM. Whether that is seen as a good or bad thing or both will vary. I think you'd have a lot of work to do to prove that a character's thoughts and feelings are part of the DM's duty to describe the environment in the way the game intends. Whether you think it's okay for a DM to step outside of his or her role and into the players' role or vice versa is up to you and your players. I would suggest it's not necessary and can be problematic. Something that adds nothing and could cause problems is not a good tool in my opinion. There is nothing in this discussion, nor most D&D discussions, that I have not already tried. Not surprisingly, the things that are supported by the game itself seem to work better in my experience than things that are not. Feelings: an emotional state or reaction. My mind is open to the fact that people play the game in different ways. It would be for you to tell me, if you want, why you think the method in which the DM steps out of his or her role and into the player role is desirable. So far as I can tell, you just think that's part of describing the environment, when that's not supported by the game at all. I'd also like to hear how you think your game would be impacted if you just stopped doing it altogether. Agreed. (y) [/QUOTE]
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