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<blockquote data-quote="Pedantic" data-source="post: 9148305" data-attributes="member: 6690965">I just don't see a meaningful difference there. The fictional space is defined by the rules. I don't especially mind PCs as exceptional, if that's the desired trope, but I don't think it resolves the question, it features whole new questions about how the PC is exceptional, what they are exceptional compared to, how their abilities relate to the standard paradigm and so on. I mean, there's no reason you can't build mechanics that support acolytes having access to only a few quite specific miracles (I'd use something like a feat chain, depending on your games chassis), but you'd still want that character to be defined by the rules in a knowable way, not a black box that's defined entirely by it's outputs.The further you lean into the exceptionalism of everything and everybody the PCs interact with, the less the fictional world and mechanics overlap and the less usefully gameable the space is. Plus it all feels increasingly artificial and disconnected. The wizard tower's defenses aren't a product of the same magic your wizard uses, it's all just set pieces. Mechanical consistency, the ability to exist and function without PC eyes on a thing are essential to giving the thing weight and making it interesting.I'm fairly amenable to the GM effort/time arguments, I just think that's a cost that pays for something, and if you don't want to pay it, you're not going to get the thing.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Pedantic, post: 9148305, member: 6690965"] I just don't see a meaningful difference there. The fictional space is defined by the rules. I don't especially mind PCs as exceptional, if that's the desired trope, but I don't think it resolves the question, it features whole new questions about how the PC is exceptional, what they are exceptional compared to, how their abilities relate to the standard paradigm and so on. I mean, there's no reason you can't build mechanics that support acolytes having access to only a few quite specific miracles (I'd use something like a feat chain, depending on your games chassis), but you'd still want that character to be defined by the rules in a knowable way, not a black box that's defined entirely by it's outputs. The further you lean into the exceptionalism of everything and everybody the PCs interact with, the less the fictional world and mechanics overlap and the less usefully gameable the space is. Plus it all feels increasingly artificial and disconnected. The wizard tower's defenses aren't a product of the same magic your wizard uses, it's all just set pieces. Mechanical consistency, the ability to exist and function without PC eyes on a thing are essential to giving the thing weight and making it interesting. I'm fairly amenable to the GM effort/time arguments, I just think that's a cost that pays for something, and if you don't want to pay it, you're not going to get the thing. [/QUOTE]

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