Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Should personality or mental stats exist?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Snarf Zagyg" data-source="post: 9253328" data-attributes="member: 7023840"><p>Well, there are quite a few reasons- but let's start with one easy one.</p><p></p><p><em>Lack of reciprocity.</em></p><p></p><p>Why are there combat rules in D&D, but not "social combat rules" with the same amount of detail? Well, there's a very simple, easy-to-understand, historical reason for this.</p><p></p><p>In D&D, player agency has almost always been considered inviolate. By player agency in D&D, I mean the ability of the player to decide what the character feels and does.</p><p></p><p>Combat is always reciprocal with monsters and NPCs. Characters do damage to the enemy, the enemy does damage to the characters using the exact same system.</p><p></p><p>Now, <em>if you start to use any advanced social combat mechanic</em> (for example), then you are left with the following outcome- either you preserve player agency, in which case players can engage in it, but the enemy cannot ... or you violate the fundamental design ethos of D&D (full player control of the player's thoughts and feelings).*</p><p></p><p>As it is, there is a limited social ability in 5e to influence NPCs with social skills, and the limitation is acknowledged by the lack of reciprocity. </p><p></p><p>As for the idea of making puzzle solving and tactical choices dependent on die rolls ... if I proposed that to any table I've run, I'd get run out of town. </p><p></p><p></p><p>*Yes, there are some limited exceptions, such as a monster or spell that causes "fear" will cause a physical response, or the possibility that an enemy could use dominate person ... but the use of dominate person against a PC, for example, is controversial, and should probably be cleared with the table.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Snarf Zagyg, post: 9253328, member: 7023840"] Well, there are quite a few reasons- but let's start with one easy one. [I]Lack of reciprocity.[/I] Why are there combat rules in D&D, but not "social combat rules" with the same amount of detail? Well, there's a very simple, easy-to-understand, historical reason for this. In D&D, player agency has almost always been considered inviolate. By player agency in D&D, I mean the ability of the player to decide what the character feels and does. Combat is always reciprocal with monsters and NPCs. Characters do damage to the enemy, the enemy does damage to the characters using the exact same system. Now, [I]if you start to use any advanced social combat mechanic[/I] (for example), then you are left with the following outcome- either you preserve player agency, in which case players can engage in it, but the enemy cannot ... or you violate the fundamental design ethos of D&D (full player control of the player's thoughts and feelings).* As it is, there is a limited social ability in 5e to influence NPCs with social skills, and the limitation is acknowledged by the lack of reciprocity. As for the idea of making puzzle solving and tactical choices dependent on die rolls ... if I proposed that to any table I've run, I'd get run out of town. *Yes, there are some limited exceptions, such as a monster or spell that causes "fear" will cause a physical response, or the possibility that an enemy could use dominate person ... but the use of dominate person against a PC, for example, is controversial, and should probably be cleared with the table. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Should personality or mental stats exist?
Top