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General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Simple fix to hybrid characters that works with the current system
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<blockquote data-quote="Safari" data-source="post: 4312286" data-attributes="member: 69125"><p>Overall I think 4e is fantasticly designed, with nice class and power descriptions. However, as I started looking in detail at the rules, something really started to disturb me. I'll take some time to explain it, so stay with me.</p><p></p><p>Basicly, the fighter, rogue, warlord and wizard have a great design. They have one primary ability score, and get benefits from 2-3 other secondary ability scores. But <strong>All</strong> their attacks key of this one score. </p><p>The way the system works, they can increase their primary ability score, and spread out the secondary, or put it all in one stat. It doesnt realy matter. The concept of the character will work whatever the players chooses.</p><p></p><p>Now comes the 'problem area'. The ranger, cleric, paladin and warlock have powers that key of 2 different ability scores, but also have secondary stats that are required. If you want a 'strong' (read optimized) character, you'll go for one primary stat and dump the other, so you can also increase one secondary stat. This leads to characters such as a Paladin's with Str 8 and two weapon fighting Rangers with Dex 8. This is no problem if you want to play this concept.</p><p></p><p>Now my favourite concept of the paladin is a strong one, or atleast with some muscle power. The system gives me a disadvantage for making this build, because a paladin with high wisdom and charisma is more effective.</p><p>Another is the dextrous ranger who can also use swords, or a strong ranger who can also use bows.</p><p></p><p>There's also the multiclass system. I have no problem with the system as written, swapping abilities etc. You 'pay' feats, get flexibility without taking over the core class. </p><p>But you'll also have to invest in the ability score, just to use a few of those powers. A lot of concepts such as fighter/wizard and rogue/wizard will be hard to pull off.</p><p></p><p>The problem i've described above isn't that big at lower levels. There's not a big difference in stats. But at higher levels your primary stats will fly up, while the rest stays low.</p><p></p><p>So i've been thinking about ways to modify this, to make certain character concepts happen more easily. Eventually i came to a very simple fix that will to some degree, make these character's very decent. </p><p></p><p>Feat:</p><p><span style="color: Sienna"></span></p><p><span style="color: Sienna"> <strong><span style="font-size: 12px">Adapted Combat Training [Heroic]</span></strong></span></p><p><span style="color: Sienna"><strong></strong></span></p><p><span style="color: Sienna"><strong> Benefit:</strong> Choose an ability score. When making an attack roll that keys off of the chosen ability, you gain a +1 feat bonus to the associated ability modifier for the purpose of the attack roll. At 11th lvl, this bonus increases to +2. At 21st lvl, it increases to +3.</span></p><p><span style="color: Sienna"> <strong>Special:</strong> The bonus gained from this feat counts as a feat bonus to attack rolls. This feat cannot cause the augmented ability modifier to exceed that of your highest ability modifier.</span></p><p></p><p>Example character that can use this:</p><p></p><p>Lvl 17 Drow Ranger</p><p></p><p>Str 16</p><p>Con 13</p><p>Dex 20</p><p>Int 14</p><p>Wis 15</p><p>Cha 13</p><p></p><p>With Adapted Training this character gets a +2 bonus on his melee attacks and powers, making it a good concept. </p><p>If the feat is taken a second time for intelligence, this character could also pick up the wizard multiclassing feat, and be decent with his wizard attacks</p><p></p><p>So what do you think? Will it lead to overpowered or broken combination's</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Safari, post: 4312286, member: 69125"] Overall I think 4e is fantasticly designed, with nice class and power descriptions. However, as I started looking in detail at the rules, something really started to disturb me. I'll take some time to explain it, so stay with me. Basicly, the fighter, rogue, warlord and wizard have a great design. They have one primary ability score, and get benefits from 2-3 other secondary ability scores. But [B]All[/B] their attacks key of this one score. The way the system works, they can increase their primary ability score, and spread out the secondary, or put it all in one stat. It doesnt realy matter. The concept of the character will work whatever the players chooses. Now comes the 'problem area'. The ranger, cleric, paladin and warlock have powers that key of 2 different ability scores, but also have secondary stats that are required. If you want a 'strong' (read optimized) character, you'll go for one primary stat and dump the other, so you can also increase one secondary stat. This leads to characters such as a Paladin's with Str 8 and two weapon fighting Rangers with Dex 8. This is no problem if you want to play this concept. Now my favourite concept of the paladin is a strong one, or atleast with some muscle power. The system gives me a disadvantage for making this build, because a paladin with high wisdom and charisma is more effective. Another is the dextrous ranger who can also use swords, or a strong ranger who can also use bows. There's also the multiclass system. I have no problem with the system as written, swapping abilities etc. You 'pay' feats, get flexibility without taking over the core class. But you'll also have to invest in the ability score, just to use a few of those powers. A lot of concepts such as fighter/wizard and rogue/wizard will be hard to pull off. The problem i've described above isn't that big at lower levels. There's not a big difference in stats. But at higher levels your primary stats will fly up, while the rest stays low. So i've been thinking about ways to modify this, to make certain character concepts happen more easily. Eventually i came to a very simple fix that will to some degree, make these character's very decent. Feat: [COLOR=Sienna] [B][SIZE=3]Adapted Combat Training [Heroic][/SIZE] Benefit:[/B] Choose an ability score. When making an attack roll that keys off of the chosen ability, you gain a +1 feat bonus to the associated ability modifier for the purpose of the attack roll. At 11th lvl, this bonus increases to +2. At 21st lvl, it increases to +3. [B]Special:[/B] The bonus gained from this feat counts as a feat bonus to attack rolls. This feat cannot cause the augmented ability modifier to exceed that of your highest ability modifier.[/COLOR] Example character that can use this: Lvl 17 Drow Ranger Str 16 Con 13 Dex 20 Int 14 Wis 15 Cha 13 With Adapted Training this character gets a +2 bonus on his melee attacks and powers, making it a good concept. If the feat is taken a second time for intelligence, this character could also pick up the wizard multiclassing feat, and be decent with his wizard attacks So what do you think? Will it lead to overpowered or broken combination's [/QUOTE]
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