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Message: <blockquote data-quote="howandwhy99" data-source="post: 6300511" data-attributes="member: 3192">2e did publish a some very bad game books which didn't even include game statistics for game components within them. But that's due to ignorance of design. Of course I'm talking about all the 1000s of books which actually do have game stats.Are you incapable of using game mechanics to provide for all those actions? D&D game books are not complete works. They are suggestions for DMs to create the codes they will use behind the screen. And alcohol, beer, scents, and tracking are hardly uncommon game components given everything that's been published.What your talking about is rhetoric and using reasoning to support such, which you've repeatedly put forth as what players in all role playing games do even though D&D and most every RPG were never designed to do this. You're simply feeding into the viewpoint of the Forge trying to purposefully confuse people into believing fiction producing games (and any conjecture that goes on about such fiction) are "the one true" role playing games and not another hobby entirely. Games are patterns. People play them to engage in strategy. Rhetoric can be a strategy and players in D&D (not DMs) can engage in it to convince fellow players to follow their courses of action. But this isn't role playing.So lawyers have been playing cooperative games hidden behind a screen tracking in memory and in their notes what the portions of the game map the DM relates? Because that's D&D and it is the unique identity which created the RPG hobby. People who hate that practice are the ones who are attempting to destroy one hobby and whitewash it with another. I trust you are educated and are who you claim to be online, but your single-minded understanding of role playing only feeds this culture of abuse whether you are deliberately part of it or not.Fictions don't reference a real world noumenon. D&D has a game board (maps actually) that are referenced by the DM. They aren't fictional for that fact. They support imaginary structure which is fantasy, not fiction. That you refuse to see that difference keeps you locked in a vocabulary which closes off any other possible understandings about RPG and D&D.In hardline postmodern theory "sharing" can only be done ironically or in delusion.Don't get caught up in game terminology. "Senses" are game abilities assigned to game pieces in the game. The abilities themselves are references to a game board (think spell area) and tied to other game boards all measurable by the DM.DMs often do say "You see an orc", but they mean "Bob, your character sees an orc" all game components and game terminolgy. "Seeing" is referencing something happening in a game. And of course the orc piece can only be seen if its within the "sight" sensory ability of the PC piece.Gygax could not have been be discussing resolution mechanics. They didn't even exist in games until the Forge invented them. Of course all those things exist, they must exist to occur in the game. You keep repeating Forge theory as fact, not that many followers treat it as less. It's as far as fact can be considering how "agenda"-driven and deliberately falsifying of self-reported understandings of games that theory was. It's not a theory, it's an ideology pushed on an ignorant gamer population. To be clear, I've not misunderstood your position here. You keep repeating it over and over as if I'm simply misunderstanding your one true way of believing. The fact is, you simply have no conception of why D&D was designed with 1000s of books and requires campaign worlds and adventures to even run. Why DMs are a necessity to playing the game. Of course those things are irrelevant in the game you play because you have no desire to play D&D as designed as you've made abundantly clear. You're pushing D&D as a storygame and not only that you're pushing all RPGs as exclusively storygames. Just about everything you purport here is just flat out wrong.EDIT: To the last bit, games and puzzles are entirely about pattern recognition. That this is not the whole of existence is obvious, but it's a key component of what makes activities games and puzzles rather than something else.</blockquote>

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