Skill-Based Magic Item Creation

[krichaiushii]

Hello.

I went back through 12 pages here in the 3d Edition House Rules section before posting; I am confident that something along these lines already exists here at Enworld, but I lack the skill to find it.

My goal is to replace the Craft Item feats with some form of skill-based system.

Ideally, this system requires no new skills, just additional uses of existing skills, primarily Knowledge (arcana/religion/nature as necessary), Spellcraft, and Concentration. Perhaps ranks in Use Magic Device and/or Craft (appropriate item type) allow for synergy bonuses.

The main drawback to a system of this sort is (unnecessary) complication of a currently simple Magic Item creation system: Earn Feat, spend XP and gold, get item.

The strengths I think exist for a skill-based creation system are: freeing up feat slots, more uses for skills, a mechanical reason for the building of personal libraries, a mechanical reason for cursed item creation, a more (in my mind) old school feel to item creation.

Explanations done, a very rough skeleton of my thoughts follows.

Knowledge (arcana/religion/nature/other) is used to determine if a caster can make a particular item, and what is necessary to do so - to include time involved once ingredients are gathered.

Spellcraft and Concentration rolls are required each day of the creation process. Failures in one or the other or both would result in cursed items, with critical successes in Spellcraft could lead to more powerful enchantments on the finished item. Multiple failures/critical successes make for a wider variance of bad/good effects.

Instead of (or in addition to?) paying XP for the items, a chance to have a point of Constitution permanently drained (modified for item permanence, item power, number of failures/successes during the crafting stage) would always hang over the head of the crafter. Among other things, this would limit the number of permanent magic items in the world.

Certain books would provide synergy bonuses to researching (Knowledge checks) specific items or types of items or items involving spells of a certain school (item formulas). This would provide a more mechanical reason for spellcasters to collect (and write) books, if such a reason is lacking.

The more powerful items would require some form of power component(s) based on DM whim - leading to other adventures.

The key lies in codifying all of the above rough ideas; DCs, modifiers, costs, crafting time, chance for Con lost...

So I come to the collective wisdom and experience of Enworld seeking suggestions, comments, advice, and perhaps pertinent links to similar threads here and abroad.

Thank you for your time.

 

[Kerrick]

My goal is to replace the Craft Item feats with some form of skill-based system.

It's a good idea... so good, in fact, that I did a skill-based system of my own. Feel free to steal what you want from it - it's all OGC.

 

[necroblivion]

I like your idea on the surface. To aid you in your quest here, I'd suggest making each type of item a skill challenge (Unearthed Arcana or 4e) using a few different skills. This certainly adds a fun new element to the game.

My only criticism is that by removing the feats, you open up a more dangerous avenue for wizards, almost forcing the player's hand to become a "blaster" metamagic wielding junky. This is a dangerous road. If your players don't succumb to this, then it will work fine for your group.

My suggestion would be add the skill challenges to the system that's in place. Perhaps even put skill ranks as requirements in the feats.

 

[Ashtagon]

Having skill ranks as a requirement is effectively saying "must be level X" to do this. But that requirement is already being met by the caster level requirement. Having two different "must be level X" requirements to make the item doesn't provide any special limitation.

There's also the fact that you are effectively removing the opportunity costs of feats entirely; feat slots are precious, but skill points are cheap.

 

[Cicciograna]

Why removing the feats? The skill system is good, but there is no need to drop the Item Creation feats. Okay, to forge a ring a PC has to do his researches, read books, consult tomes of lore and knowledge (i.e. Knowledge skill check), and then perform all the needed rituals and conjurations (i.e. Spellcraft and Concentration); but prior to this he has to assimilate the process of ring forging, to fully understand the formulas and chants to create a magic ring, to attune himself and his soul to the expenditure of personal essence for the creation of this wonder. In short, he has to pick the Forge Ring feat.

 

[krichaiushii]

First off, thanks to all of you for your input.

Kerrick, I stumbled across your system some time ago, and am now relooking at it. Incidentally, I downloaded your 'classes' file, but Wizard was missing.

necroblivion, Ashtagon, and Cicciograna - I hadn't considered the logical result of removing item creation feats, thanks for pointing it out. That said, combining the feats AND a skill-check system could work. I will look into skill challenges.

You've all provided excellent food for thought, which is why I came here to ask my question.

When I hammer out more specifics, I will post them; feel free to add more comments and suggestions, though.

Thanks again!

 

[Kerrick]

Kerrick, I stumbled across your system some time ago, and am now relooking at it. Incidentally, I downloaded your 'classes' file, but Wizard was missing.

That's because it wasn't done at the time. I recently completed it (finally), so you can get it now. I'm currently reworking the cleric.