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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ExploderWizard" data-source="post: 4628196" data-attributes="member: 66434">The one thing I notice about skill challenges and the largest problem is one of exclusion. PC's that do not have the skills to attempt a roll withanything less than close to the optimum bonuses just end up aidingsomeone else or sitting on the bench to avoid dragging down the teamwith a poor roll. 4E overhauled the classes in a major way to help ensure thatevery PC could meaningfully contribute to the action. As far as combat encounters go I think the goal was achieved, but non-combat encountersdidn't get the same treatment. The three failures baseline for failure is theequivalent of saying that once three hits are scored against the partybefore they can score five or six, the combat is over and the PC's lose. In a combat encounter, every PC has a variety of actions thatcan be performed each round. All classes were given powers that are useful in the encounter. Powers that, to me, make no senseas to why they would work in certain situations simply workbecause the overall goal was to ensure useful actions for everyone.In addition to these powers and attacks, are improvised stunts that maybe attempted with varying degrees of success. My point here is thatcombat isn't restricted to a static menu of actions (no matter how much the character sheet makes it appear so<img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue    :p"  data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" />)but the skill challenge mechanics as written ARE structured that way.  Even if we removed stunts from combat, every PC would have a fairly decent list of actions to perform no matter what the circumstances of the particular fight happen to be. On a skill challenge based on socialand knowledge related skills, the jock types help the party most by sitting out of the encounter and letting the brains handle everything. This would be like having those skilled at diplomacy sitting out of combat because they would be a liability to the party and couldn't help. I like the skill challenge concept. A sequence of events moving ata quick pace, with success hinging on some key die rolls that isn't combatis a good thing. The system needs to allow for things like stunts and improvisationto bring the inclusiveness level up to the same level as combat encounters.Simulationism was trampled to death in the name of equal participation in combat, why not apply the concept to non-combat encounters as well?</blockquote>

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