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<blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 8741112" data-attributes="member: 82106">I think people are overestimating the degree to which the intent in 4e is for all these various elements beyond the number of successes and failures to be used rote as exactly written. There are advantages, different DCs, possible 'use a ritual and get a success' (or other resources), etc. It is not really exactly spelled out that every one of these must be in play exactly to the letter of the blurb on each one. My take on SC rules, as of RC or basically DMG2, is you have the tally of successes and failures based on Complexity, a level, and the GM can decree various things like primary and secondary skills, some number of advantages, etc. as it seems like the situation is best served. Some of these things have pretty precise guidelines, like the number of advantages and the number of different DCs of checks that you should use appear in the complexity table, so you PROBABLY use them as-is. OTOH the rules on what happens when a ritual gets cast, or a power used, are quite a bit more vague and clearly owe so much to the fiction that whatever is said is at best advisory.So, I think [USER=6696971]@Manbearcat[/USER] kind of decided that if you use a ritual, you make a ritual check, and you get AT LEAST the one success for paying to do the ritual plus maybe another one if the ritual check is sufficiently good. Now, if it was a different ritual, maybe one that doesn't scale its outcome based on the check, or doesn't even have a check, maybe he would call it differently. You'll have to ask him. I think he stated the SC was Complexity 3 anyway, right? So maybe that was why it was at least that high, I'm not sure...</blockquote>

[QUOTE="AbdulAlhazred, post: 8741112, member: 82106"] I think people are overestimating the degree to which the intent in 4e is for all these various elements beyond the number of successes and failures to be used rote as exactly written. There are advantages, different DCs, possible 'use a ritual and get a success' (or other resources), etc. It is not really exactly spelled out that every one of these must be in play exactly to the letter of the blurb on each one. My take on SC rules, as of RC or basically DMG2, is you have the tally of successes and failures based on Complexity, a level, and the GM can decree various things like primary and secondary skills, some number of advantages, etc. as it seems like the situation is best served. Some of these things have pretty precise guidelines, like the number of advantages and the number of different DCs of checks that you should use appear in the complexity table, so you PROBABLY use them as-is. OTOH the rules on what happens when a ritual gets cast, or a power used, are quite a bit more vague and clearly owe so much to the fiction that whatever is said is at best advisory. So, I think [USER=6696971]@Manbearcat[/USER] kind of decided that if you use a ritual, you make a ritual check, and you get AT LEAST the one success for paying to do the ritual plus maybe another one if the ritual check is sufficiently good. Now, if it was a different ritual, maybe one that doesn't scale its outcome based on the check, or doesn't even have a check, maybe he would call it differently. You'll have to ask him. I think he stated the SC was Complexity 3 anyway, right? So maybe that was why it was at least that high, I'm not sure... [/QUOTE]

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