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<blockquote data-quote="Primal" data-source="post: 4161771" data-attributes="member: 30678">1) I thought the *player* sets the DC by choosing how &quot;hard&quot; he wants the challenge to be? In that sense I'd say that 4E succeeds, although in a &quot;rough&quot; and somewhat limited fashion, encouraging a more &quot;narrative&quot; style for out-of-combat challenges (of course, most Indie RPGs do this in a more elegant and coherent fashion, but it's a good start).2) This is actually how many Indie RPGs encourage the players to brazenly metagame and &quot;think out of the box&quot;. In Dust Devils, you can even always use your highest skill in conflicts, *if* you manage to bring it into the story in a creative and credible way. In my experience this has encouraged creativity and immersion in the story. However, if the DM lets pretty much anything fly without any adjudication (i.e. the players are not required to describe how the skill would apply in the situation), it's a valid concern that the Skill Challenges turn into a routine roll using your highest modifier in any situation.&nbsp; I'm very much against 4E, but the Skill Challenge system is actually one of the few things I like. It may not suit everyone's style, but my campaigns would probably benefit (storywise) a lot out of it. If (and that's a *BIG* 'If') my group will ever try 4E, I'm definitely going to use this system.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Primal, post: 4161771, member: 30678"] 1) I thought the *player* sets the DC by choosing how "hard" he wants the challenge to be? In that sense I'd say that 4E succeeds, although in a "rough" and somewhat limited fashion, encouraging a more "narrative" style for out-of-combat challenges (of course, most Indie RPGs do this in a more elegant and coherent fashion, but it's a good start). 2) This is actually how many Indie RPGs encourage the players to brazenly metagame and "think out of the box". In Dust Devils, you can even always use your highest skill in conflicts, *if* you manage to bring it into the story in a creative and credible way. In my experience this has encouraged creativity and immersion in the story. However, if the DM lets pretty much anything fly without any adjudication (i.e. the players are not required to describe how the skill would apply in the situation), it's a valid concern that the Skill Challenges turn into a routine roll using your highest modifier in any situation. I'm very much against 4E, but the Skill Challenge system is actually one of the few things I like. It may not suit everyone's style, but my campaigns would probably benefit (storywise) a lot out of it. If (and that's a *BIG* 'If') my group will ever try 4E, I'm definitely going to use this system. [/QUOTE]

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