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<blockquote data-quote="Greenfield" data-source="post: 7343164" data-attributes="member: 6669384">I've played 4E, and I found I liked the general idea of Skill Challenges, a formal framework for non-combat challenges.&nbsp; The 4E mechanics had their problems, but the concept was appealing.How would/should we go about implementing such a thing in 3.*?One problem I saw with 4e was tied to the highly specialized/focused nature of skills in that edition:&nbsp; You either had the skill or you didn't, with no gradation or granularity.&nbsp; People selected Skills that they had the stats to back, so if they had it they were generally god-like in that area, and if they didn't have the stat/skill they were a pure liability.&nbsp; As a result, only PCs with the right skills ever participated.Another issue I had was the meta-game aspect:&nbsp; For example, the party is pursuing someone across the desert.&nbsp; Tracking/Survival is an obvious element.&nbsp; So is Endurance.&nbsp; If horses are being used, Ride and Handle Animal come into play, making character Endurance less of an issue.&nbsp; Perhaps a Knowledge of Geography, to try and figure out where the enemy is heading.When run in 4e, one character will likely make the tracking checks, which is fine.&nbsp; He'll likely make the Endurance, Survival and Ride checks, perhaps even the Handle Animal ones.&nbsp; And because he has good numbers, nobody else gets lost or tired, none of them get any saddle sores and their horses remain in good condition.And if anyone who doesn't have the Skill and the Ability to back it up even reaches for a D20, they get slapped down.I want to change that last part.&nbsp; &nbsp; So overall I'd want to see some requirement that every PC has to contribute, with perhaps a minor penalty if they don't.&nbsp; Even an unskilled or low skilled person can contribute an Aid Another check on a lot of skills.&nbsp; And the Skilled person can Aid Another for the low skilled.&nbsp; &quot;Here, you need to snug the saddle cinches evenly or your horse will end up with sores.&nbsp; And don't give him too much water all at once after a long hot ride.&nbsp; You can make him sick.&quot;I'd also probably want a framework where the Challenge Rating of the Skill Challenge (for EXP purposes) would be based on the baseline DC of the Skill Checks involved.Perhaps, instead of a &quot;X number of successes before Y number of failures&quot; goal, maybes a total required success count, with each failure subtracting from the total.&nbsp; More attempts, of course, takes more time, so a time limit element would seem appropriate.Let's kick this around a bit, see if we can come up with something that works.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Greenfield, post: 7343164, member: 6669384"] I've played 4E, and I found I liked the general idea of Skill Challenges, a formal framework for non-combat challenges. The 4E mechanics had their problems, but the concept was appealing. How would/should we go about implementing such a thing in 3.*? One problem I saw with 4e was tied to the highly specialized/focused nature of skills in that edition: You either had the skill or you didn't, with no gradation or granularity. People selected Skills that they had the stats to back, so if they had it they were generally god-like in that area, and if they didn't have the stat/skill they were a pure liability. As a result, only PCs with the right skills ever participated. Another issue I had was the meta-game aspect: For example, the party is pursuing someone across the desert. Tracking/Survival is an obvious element. So is Endurance. If horses are being used, Ride and Handle Animal come into play, making character Endurance less of an issue. Perhaps a Knowledge of Geography, to try and figure out where the enemy is heading. When run in 4e, one character will likely make the tracking checks, which is fine. He'll likely make the Endurance, Survival and Ride checks, perhaps even the Handle Animal ones. And because he has good numbers, nobody else gets lost or tired, none of them get any saddle sores and their horses remain in good condition. And if anyone who doesn't have the Skill and the Ability to back it up even reaches for a D20, they get slapped down. I want to change that last part. So overall I'd want to see some requirement that every PC has to contribute, with perhaps a minor penalty if they don't. Even an unskilled or low skilled person can contribute an Aid Another check on a lot of skills. And the Skilled person can Aid Another for the low skilled. "Here, you need to snug the saddle cinches evenly or your horse will end up with sores. And don't give him too much water all at once after a long hot ride. You can make him sick." I'd also probably want a framework where the Challenge Rating of the Skill Challenge (for EXP purposes) would be based on the baseline DC of the Skill Checks involved. Perhaps, instead of a "X number of successes before Y number of failures" goal, maybes a total required success count, with each failure subtracting from the total. More attempts, of course, takes more time, so a time limit element would seem appropriate. Let's kick this around a bit, see if we can come up with something that works. [/QUOTE]

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