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<blockquote data-quote="kutulu" data-source="post: 4687480" data-attributes="member: 82459">No longer true.&nbsp; The errata for the DMG deleted whole chunks of the skill challenge rules.&nbsp; In particular, there's no initiative rolling, and there's no requirement that everyone participate.&nbsp; I just ran three of them today for a group new to 4e.&nbsp; For reference: the three-in-a-row skill challenges from the beginning of Rescue at Rivenroar.&nbsp; The two social ones actually turned out pretty good, though I admit our cleric, the diplomacy guy, did most of the talking.&nbsp; The third one, walking through the woods, seemed as bad as everyone claims: mechanical, forced, etc.&nbsp; But oddly enough, it was the only one the players &quot;got&quot;, that had a definitive goal of &quot;find the castle before you run into bears or collapse in exhaustion&quot;, and overall the players never seemed too bored with them.The new rules also make the challenges &quot;fail fast&quot; -- every complexity challenge fails on 3 failed checks.&nbsp; I was hesitant at first but seeing this in action it makes a lot of sense.&nbsp; When my players were talking to a nobleman to try and get a job, they made two failed bluff checks.&nbsp; At that point, in my own mind, it was obvious that the guy wasn't gonna put up with much more crap from them.The hardest part of the whole encounter, to me, is figuring out what kind of incremental progress to give the players.&nbsp; I'm getting better at it, but knowing where the players &quot;want to go&quot; I sometimes give away too much too early, which makes continuing the challenge silly.I would really like to hear a skill challenge or three in the PA/PvP podcasts, and see how a WotC employee thinks they should be run.--K</blockquote>

[QUOTE="kutulu, post: 4687480, member: 82459"] No longer true. The errata for the DMG deleted whole chunks of the skill challenge rules. In particular, there's no initiative rolling, and there's no requirement that everyone participate. I just ran three of them today for a group new to 4e. For reference: the three-in-a-row skill challenges from the beginning of Rescue at Rivenroar. The two social ones actually turned out pretty good, though I admit our cleric, the diplomacy guy, did most of the talking. The third one, walking through the woods, seemed as bad as everyone claims: mechanical, forced, etc. But oddly enough, it was the only one the players "got", that had a definitive goal of "find the castle before you run into bears or collapse in exhaustion", and overall the players never seemed too bored with them. The new rules also make the challenges "fail fast" -- [B]every[/B] complexity challenge fails on 3 failed checks. I was hesitant at first but seeing this in action it makes a lot of sense. When my players were talking to a nobleman to try and get a job, they made two failed bluff checks. At that point, in my own mind, it was obvious that the guy wasn't gonna put up with much more crap from them. The hardest part of the whole encounter, to me, is figuring out what kind of incremental progress to give the players. I'm getting better at it, but knowing where the players "want to go" I sometimes give away too much too early, which makes continuing the challenge silly. I would [B]really[/B] like to hear a skill challenge or three in the PA/PvP podcasts, and see how a WotC employee thinks they should be run. --K [/QUOTE]

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