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<blockquote data-quote="Oofta" data-source="post: 7857609" data-attributes="member: 6801845">I fall pretty clearly into perspective A.&nbsp; I think trying to come up with one system of DCs that can apply across all tables and all situations is a never-ending rabbit hole of exceptions and clarifications.&nbsp; Ultimately it didn't even really matter that much, it just moved where the decision was made.For example IIRC 3.5 had a table with DCs for climbing.&nbsp; Everything from 0 to 25(?) was covered with examples.&nbsp; But then there were modifiers and adjustments and explanations.&nbsp; Ultimately it didn't really matter though because it was the DM who decided what kind of wall needed to be climbed.&nbsp; Was that a steep slope?&nbsp; A craggy surface with plenty of handholds?&nbsp; Was the wall icy, was it windy, was it a Tuesday?&nbsp; Add all that stuff up and you get a DC.&nbsp; It just shortcuts a whole lot of needless calculation to say it's going to be a difficult DC 20 and come up with some justification if you need one.&nbsp; You end up at the same end point anyway.&nbsp; The wall isn't real, it's whatever the DM wants it to be.As far as judging what PCs can accomplish I do use reality as a rough baseline.&nbsp; Then I crank it up to Action Movie possible.&nbsp; Depending on the campaign I may crank it up a notch or two above that.&nbsp; But you have to start somewhere, and I don't care how good you are you can't climb a waterfall in my campaign.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Oofta, post: 7857609, member: 6801845"] I fall pretty clearly into perspective A. I think trying to come up with one system of DCs that can apply across all tables and all situations is a never-ending rabbit hole of exceptions and clarifications. Ultimately it didn't even really matter that much, it just moved where the decision was made. For example IIRC 3.5 had a table with DCs for climbing. Everything from 0 to 25(?) was covered with examples. But then there were modifiers and adjustments and explanations. Ultimately it didn't really matter though because it was the DM who decided what kind of wall needed to be climbed. Was that a steep slope? A craggy surface with plenty of handholds? Was the wall icy, was it windy, was it a Tuesday? Add all that stuff up and you get a DC. It just shortcuts a whole lot of needless calculation to say it's going to be a difficult DC 20 and come up with some justification if you need one. You end up at the same end point anyway. The wall isn't real, it's whatever the DM wants it to be. As far as judging what PCs can accomplish I do use reality as a rough baseline. Then I crank it up to Action Movie possible. Depending on the campaign I may crank it up a notch or two above that. But you have to start somewhere, and I don't care how good you are you can't climb a waterfall in my campaign. [/QUOTE]

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