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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Quickleaf" data-source="post: 6270886" data-attributes="member: 20323">I see, so it would just be a layer of rules on top of the DC rules. But then, at least as Mike Mearls outlines it, how do you explain an Apprentice making an Apprentice DC check needing to get a 15+, Journeyman making a Journeyman DC check needing to get a 15+, and a Master making a Master DC check needing to get a 15+?It's pretty clear from his system that the named DCs don't correspond to numbers in the way we normally think on numbered DCs.That makes sense, but then you're back to Perception checks by another name, except the DM is the one who calls for them.And then there's opposed Perception vs Stealth/Thievery checks. That would seem to circumvent this system entirely.So the only difference is naming it at the table "DC 15" or a "Journeyman task"? I think it's a bit deeper...What you need to establish in this system is what a discrete skill ranking means, what tasks you can accomplish at that rank that no one of lesser skill could. By way of comparison, in a numbered DC system like 4e where anyone can make any check, you don't need to think about the narrative difference between Acrobatics +5 and Acrobatics +15, since both characters can attempts a DC 20 Acrobatics check to balance across a 2" ledge.In this system, there is something narrative implied about the 2" ledge and it's relationship to the PCs that means a PC with Apprentice training cannot hope to attempt it (without some clever plan or assistance to shift the DIfficulty) while a PC with Journeyman training can do it no problem. Now a judgment call has to be made about what is within that Journeyman cutoff, because the cutoff is especially impactful on play. The DCs become fuzzy. How a DM applies them will vary from table to table, heck, how a single DM applies them may vary from week to week. Is DC 16, 17, or 18 closer to Apprentice or Journeyman?Hah <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> Great answer! I have 2 clarifying questions...First, I don't know about your group, but one of the things I've noticed in my 4e games is PCs sometimes have to make checks that aren't their strongest. For example, Endurance checks for poison gas. Let's say there is only one character who has to make the check, cut off from the rest of the party. If their Endurance doesnt meet the Journeyman DC, they just fail outright, no chance for a roll?Second, what about two evenly matched PCs? Say, a Druid and a ranger both have Master rank in Nature, and are attempting to recall a Master DC bit of natural lore. Who leads the check? Do they both get to roll?</blockquote>

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