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Message: <blockquote data-quote="sheadunne" data-source="post: 6095139" data-attributes="member: 27570">I'm not arguing for or against. My preferred style is not the 4e mechanic, it's not even the 3e mechanic, 2e or 1e mechanic. I was simply pointing out the rationale. Logically it makes perfect sense. I cannot think of one player that could not bypass a simple lock with ease at 20th level, whether it's bashing it down, summoning a creature, or simply teleporting around it. It's a none issue. It's only there because there's suppose to be a lock there. It's certainly not put there to challenge anyone. Is there an example you can give where a 20th level anything cannot easily bypass a simple lock? Sure there might be corner cases where there's sneaking involved, but that's not really any reason to see major issue with the 4e method. That method is only an issue with the disconnect with adding level to skill checks. You can use any mechanic you like in any edition you like, but that lock is still not going to be a challenge to high level characters. 4e uses an approach to that, by saying don't even bother trying to make it a challenge. earlier editions leave it in there because it's keeping with the real-world aspect, but it's still not a challenge. Neither direction is particularly good for all styles of play, but they both achieve the same result, that lock is just not an issue. Should the simple lock be an issue for a high level party? If no, then it really is just a matter of flavor which system you use. Either or any is fine that allows the lock to be ignored. If yes, then there are several issues with the system that need to be ironed out, in addition to flat-math. For instance, what has the rogue been doing for the last 20 levels? Why didn't the wizard memorized Knock 15 levels ago when the locks were a real issue? Why didn't the fighter smack it to pieces? Why didn't the cleric summon something to eat the lock? I just think you reach a point when certain things become dungeon dressing and not a challenge. It's just the nature of the game. Pick your flavor and move on, it's going to happen in 5e the way it's happened in every edition so far. That lock just won't be a challenge to high level characters.</blockquote>

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