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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ahglock" data-source="post: 4259804" data-attributes="member: 56725">Even an int focussed mage can take advantage of this, lets say you went with a 20 int, 13 wis, 13 chr.  You do not need to put any more points into charisma, your free action at level 1 gives you just an additional -1 to there savesso using derrens math but starting with a 13 wis(which I totally could be screwing up)* start with a 13 Wisdom (+1)* At 30th level characters can raise two stats by 8 (+4)* Spell Focus gives a -2 save penalty* Demigod ED gives +2 to WisIn the end this ability gives a -8 to saves.Fairly cool and not even optimized for this while keeping the high int for reflex defense and bitting with your spells.   If a person was not obsessed with having a 20 INT(admittedly I would be with any wizard I made) then they could have a 18 INT after the +2 and what a 16 wis and still have points for chr.  so:* start with a 1 Wisdom (+3)* At 30th level characters can raise two stats by 8 (+4)* Spell Focus gives a -2 save penalty* Demigod ED gives +2 to WisIn the end this ability gives a -10 to saves.I don't know if this is broken yet or anything but it does seem powerful, what kind of bonuses to saves to high ad epic level monsters have.  The dragon in the sample adventure had a +5 and he was a low level dragon.    If someone thinks this is an issue where too many monsters have way too low of a chance to save, then a quick houserule would be to limit the penalties to saves to countering bonuses, so it leaves these spells as an option for powerful monsters while not making them dominating vs any monster without the 4e equivalent to spell resistance.</blockquote>

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