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General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Slim down the core rules *how to remove AoO's?*
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<blockquote data-quote="Alcamtar" data-source="post: 1766744" data-attributes="member: 3842"><p>You can remove skills and feats easily, and end up with something that looks a lot like AD&D. However balance will be severely disrupted.</p><p></p><p>I experimented with a simplified Fighter based on the NPC Warrior template. Since Warrior CR is one less than Fighter CR at every level, you can replace a Fighter of level N with a Warrior of level N+1 and get rid of all those pesky Fighter feats. Then if you assign all the Warrior's feats to Toughness, you've essentially given him +1 hp per level, which is the same as a d12 hit die. That gives us:</p><p></p><p>Simplified Fighter</p><p>Level 1, HD 2d12, BAB +2</p><p>Level 2, HD 3d12, BAB +3</p><p>Level 4, HD 4d12, BAB +4</p><p>Level 5, HD 5d12, BAB +5</p><p>Level 6, HD 6d12, BAB +6/+1</p><p>etc...</p><p></p><p>The character has no feats at all and is theoretically balanced. I don't believe he is REALLY balanced however, so I'd also give him Power Attack for free -- it is useless at low levels and helpful at higher levels. Also I might allow simplified fighters to choose a 'kit' in teh form of a single feat (ignoring prerequisites):</p><p>-- Melee Specialist = Great Cleave</p><p>-- Ranged Specialist = Fast Reload or Rapid Fire</p><p>-- Swashbuckler = Finesse or Spring Attack </p><p>-- Cavalier = Mounted Combat or Spirited Charge</p><p>That allows minor customization and gives them something special they can do to keep things even. Maybe grant the specialization at level 4 or something.</p><p></p><p>I should mention my goal in this is to be 100% compatible with the RAW, give players the option of which way they want to generate their characters, and give me (as GM) a greatly simplified way to create NPCs on the fly. To stay balanced, you're going to have to offset flexibility with raw power.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I have thought and thought about how to do this. As mentioned I would prefer to retain compatibility. My two main problems with AOO are:</p><p></p><p>(a) It was intended to limit spellcasters and ranged weapons in melee, but give the "5 foot step back" trick, it effectively does neither.</p><p></p><p>FIX: If any foe within your threatened zone takes a 5 foot step away from you, you may follow immediately as a free action. So if the wizard tries to step back and lightning bolt an orc, the orc can simple step forward and maintain his threat. The wizard really shouldn't be in melee in the first place, and the fighters in the party should be protected him. POSSIBLE PROBLEM: This might make it too easy to take out enemy spellcasters. They'll need beefy bodyguards to hold and/or grapple would-be assailants.</p><p></p><p>(b) It was also intended to allow a line of characters to form a defensive line and now allow foes to run between/past. This would work in theory except that in my experience, character rarely try to run through enemy lines anyway. Instead what it accomplishes is everyone making these huge circular movements, carefully counting squares, etc... which is really goofy.</p><p></p><p>FIX: I don't have a good fix for this except for maybe borrowing the old "engagement" rule for AD&D: You are engaged in melee as soon as your (or your foe) attempts a melee attack roll. You may only make AOO if you are (1) engaged with a foe, or (2) holding your action. Alternately if you still want to allow AOO at random passers-by, assign a -4 penalty or something.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Alcamtar, post: 1766744, member: 3842"] You can remove skills and feats easily, and end up with something that looks a lot like AD&D. However balance will be severely disrupted. I experimented with a simplified Fighter based on the NPC Warrior template. Since Warrior CR is one less than Fighter CR at every level, you can replace a Fighter of level N with a Warrior of level N+1 and get rid of all those pesky Fighter feats. Then if you assign all the Warrior's feats to Toughness, you've essentially given him +1 hp per level, which is the same as a d12 hit die. That gives us: Simplified Fighter Level 1, HD 2d12, BAB +2 Level 2, HD 3d12, BAB +3 Level 4, HD 4d12, BAB +4 Level 5, HD 5d12, BAB +5 Level 6, HD 6d12, BAB +6/+1 etc... The character has no feats at all and is theoretically balanced. I don't believe he is REALLY balanced however, so I'd also give him Power Attack for free -- it is useless at low levels and helpful at higher levels. Also I might allow simplified fighters to choose a 'kit' in teh form of a single feat (ignoring prerequisites): -- Melee Specialist = Great Cleave -- Ranged Specialist = Fast Reload or Rapid Fire -- Swashbuckler = Finesse or Spring Attack -- Cavalier = Mounted Combat or Spirited Charge That allows minor customization and gives them something special they can do to keep things even. Maybe grant the specialization at level 4 or something. I should mention my goal in this is to be 100% compatible with the RAW, give players the option of which way they want to generate their characters, and give me (as GM) a greatly simplified way to create NPCs on the fly. To stay balanced, you're going to have to offset flexibility with raw power. I have thought and thought about how to do this. As mentioned I would prefer to retain compatibility. My two main problems with AOO are: (a) It was intended to limit spellcasters and ranged weapons in melee, but give the "5 foot step back" trick, it effectively does neither. FIX: If any foe within your threatened zone takes a 5 foot step away from you, you may follow immediately as a free action. So if the wizard tries to step back and lightning bolt an orc, the orc can simple step forward and maintain his threat. The wizard really shouldn't be in melee in the first place, and the fighters in the party should be protected him. POSSIBLE PROBLEM: This might make it too easy to take out enemy spellcasters. They'll need beefy bodyguards to hold and/or grapple would-be assailants. (b) It was also intended to allow a line of characters to form a defensive line and now allow foes to run between/past. This would work in theory except that in my experience, character rarely try to run through enemy lines anyway. Instead what it accomplishes is everyone making these huge circular movements, carefully counting squares, etc... which is really goofy. FIX: I don't have a good fix for this except for maybe borrowing the old "engagement" rule for AD&D: You are engaged in melee as soon as your (or your foe) attempts a melee attack roll. You may only make AOO if you are (1) engaged with a foe, or (2) holding your action. Alternately if you still want to allow AOO at random passers-by, assign a -4 penalty or something. [/QUOTE]
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