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Message: <blockquote data-quote="CCamfield" data-source="post: 2693768" data-attributes="member: 8123">Well, I read on rpg.net in a discussion of non-combat-oriented games, like, a hypothetical Agatha Christie like murder mystery, that combat could in fact be resolved by a single roll.Which is to say that games do (and should) have more detailed resolution for the things that they are focussing on, and less for what doesn't matter so much to that game.Anyhow, regarding your arguments above, I would say that you seem to be missing something, and it is this:When a player decides what tavern their character is going to visit in town, what spell to memorize, or when to bull rush, or what else to do in combat, they are making decisions for their character.  The results of these actions is determined by rolling dice and adding the appropriate bonuses and penalties based on the character's abilities and the situation.When you confront the characters with a puzzle that the players have to solve, the result of the puzzle-solving by the characters is going to be based on the players' abilities.   That is different from combat.It seems to me, both in the fact that some people are for puzzles and some against it, that this is a play style issue not unlike roleplaying social situations.  Some GMs want their players to roleplay out, I don't know, questioning an informant.  Others are happy if the players just roll.RANT:  Oh, and on the issue of attributes, I note that in the PHB, it says (in the definition of Wisdom) "While Intelligence represents one's ability to analyze information, Wisdom represents being in tune with and aware of one's surroundings."  I'm not sure how puzzle solving is anything BUT analyzing information, and quite honestly, being pedantic about the definition of the Intelligence attribute based on the very brief entries in the PHB is just ridiculous.  It is quite obviously the most appropriate attribute to use if the character got to make a puzzle-solving roll.There are ways you could resolve a complex puzzle in between having the players figure it out entirely, and resolving it with a single roll.  For instance, if you are giving them clues, then you could allow that successful Intelligence checks will give the players some hints about how to connect those clues together - hints which follow from the information they have collected.One of the frustrating things about puzzles, like mystery adventures, is that sometimes the solution seems reasonably easy to the GM, but the players miss a clue or they miss the significance of a clue, and the GM hasn't provided an excess of clues which is needed to be able to solve the mystery when you DON'T know the solution.At the end of the day, though, what's most important is what is fun for your players.</blockquote>

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