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Message: <blockquote data-quote="DonTadow" data-source="post: 2697338" data-attributes="member: 22622">As previously stated, what you have listed is mechanics set aside to aleviate character /world interaction that no other logical method can aleviate.  For instance, you can not kill a orc and whereas initiative is not whom is fasted (its whose instinct is quicker) running a race would be too distractive in most campaigns.  However, having a character solve an in game puzzle is very much easily done as previously stated by myself and others.  It also takes up far less time than combat.  From the first adventures in the late 70s there have always been dungeon rooms trapped and locked by different means.  My statement is that they are just as much apart of the game as combat.  What it seems like you're saying is that it is illogical for puzzles to be in the game.  From your example, it sounds like dungeons and dragons is a combat oriented game based solely on the mechanics.  You even go as far as to equate role playing to roll playing.  Say Ugh goes into a room in the room Ugh sees three symbols , which is elven for the letters "r", "b" and "g".  Ugh walks into the next room and after searching the room finds three orbs a red one a blue one and a green one.  Are you saying that the player of ugh should roll a d20 to figure it out because it is too much of a stretch for the player as ugh could never come up with hte solution.  Even if Ugh is an intelligence of 6 it is very likely that he could figure this out.  Or, say the party comes upon a murder, are you saying that it is ok to roll a int check to pull a sherlock holmes and automatically deduce from all the evidence the killer.  Puzzles, mysteries and riddles allow the character to take on roles just as much as a heavy fighter does.  I can use from my example, that I loved Indiana Jones growing up.  I've created several type characters and solving a well placed clue provided puzzle is just as fulfilling as killing the vampire. Of course this is a preference.  But globally, pertaining to this thread, there was nothing preventing my Indiana Jones type character from breaking roleplaying when he encounters a typical dungeon puzzle.  Perhaps this is revelevant to an earlier response that stated that you have to be an experienced dm to come up with good dungeon oriented puzzles.Now, I will agree that putting a trig problem in the middle of a series of caveryns is silly, but the orb example i gave is very much likely and similar puzzles , riddles and dungeon rooms can be found in any fantasy novel, movie, or television show.What it sounds like , is you'd rather skip the puzzle solving part of the game to move on to combat.  That's fine.  But that is not a reason as to why puzzles deviate from role playing.</blockquote>

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