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Message: <blockquote data-quote="KarinsDad" data-source="post: 5412857" data-attributes="member: 2011">No, but you are willing to give Quarry to the Ranger automatically.Ranger with CA: 17.75375Ranger w/o CA: 15.87875Ranger with CA w/o quarry: 14.15Ranger w/o CA w/o quarry: 12.45Rogue with CA: 19.9Rogue w/o CA: 9.85Let's be realistic here. Stealth rarely gives CA in many combat scenarios. In order to get hidden and hence get CA from Stealth, the Ranger has to find a location that has total concealment or superior cover. As a general rule, NPCs don't have hidden little nooks and crannies floating around their lairsYes, one might find this in the woods, but it's a somewhat rare occurance in the game system.It would much easier for a Rogue with the Cunning Sneak Rogue Tactic to gain CA via Stealth than it ever would be for the Ranger with a bow to gain stealth.Stealth used to be just cover or concealment to use. That's no longer the rule. The best the Ranger can typically do is fire without CA on round #1 without superior cover, and then move into superior cover. On round #2, move back to just cover and fire with CA. In such a scenario, he could gain CA every other round just by moving into and out of superior cover every other round. Course, a good DM wouldn't just let this happen every single encounter either.As to other PCs giving CA to the Ranger, yes that can happen. However, it doesn't happen every single round. It might happen a couple of times per encounter. And, the Ranger probably won't be using Twin Strike on most of those "I now have CA" rounds. He'll more likely use an Encounter attack power or even a Daily attack power, trying to set up his own abillities.The Defender, on the other hand, is going to try to set the Rogue up for flank every single round.When there is 10 DPR difference between CA and no CA for the Rogue, you know that the players are going to try to set up CA for the Rogue whenever possible. They are not going to go out of their way to do that for the Ranger as frequently because the difference is so slim.So yes, I suspect that the 19.9 DPR Rogue attacking with CA will happen most of the time. The 17.75375 DPR Ranger attacking with CA will happen a lot less frequently, probably at most half of the time in the best of cases.And note: CA is not the same as things like a +2 power bonus to hit. So yes, other PCs will often give buffs to both the Rogue and the Ranger, but CA is a different beast.Another thing to look at is average damage.The Rogue in your example here does 20.5 average damage if he hits.The Ranger in your example here does either 12 average damage (one attack hits) or 20.5 average damage (both attacks hit).From your "spike" theory above, it would appear to the DM that the Rogue is spiking more than the Ranger. The Ranger only does 20.5 damage 56% of the time. The Rogue does 20.5 damage 95% of the time.Sure, the Ranger will get the occasional round of 30 points of damage. But the Rogue is slapping down 20 points of damage nearly every single round.</blockquote>

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