Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Manbearcat" data-source="post: 6851409" data-attributes="member: 6696971">In the last 1-30 game of 4e I ran, the Human Rogue character was built as an Artful Dodger w/ a Duelist suite of powers/feats, Secrets of the City At-Will Utility, Mariner Theme, Bard Multi-class/Bardic Knowledge/Connected feats, and Jack-of-all-Trades Paragon Path.  His Dex and Cha were huge.  In an urban environment, he could sub his ridiculous Streetwise check for every relevant investigation/knowledge check (and roll twice!).  He could reroll any skill check he wanted 1/encounter.  He could AP for + 5 skill checks to a pair of action declarations. He was Trained in 11/17 skills.  All of his skills had absurd modifiers.Every scene on a ship, in a fight, and in the wilderness, he was the Dread Pirate Roberts.Every scene in the city he was Sherlock Holmes.Every scene anywhere he was MacGyver.It was virtually impossible for the group to suffer a story loss by "losing a scene (Skill Challenge)" due to the potency of this character in noncombat conflict resolution.  Whats more, because of this suite of PC build resources, I'm obliged to frame him into scenes and fail forward (soft failures mid-challenge) in ways that reflect these archetypes (and the stakes, of course).Through Paragon tier, he had a 14 Int.  By level 18, the Eladrin F/M (Bladesinger) had a 23 Int (+2 mod vs +6) when the Rogue had that 14.  There is another example in my current Dungeon World game.  The Arcane Duelist (basically a Bladesinger) has a maxed (18 Int) which provides a + 3 bonus to Int-derived moves.  Due to this on most Spout Lore moves, I'm obliged to tell him something useful and interesting about his present situation (or let him tell me).  On pretty much all the rest, he at least gets something interesting.  The Ranger's Int is average, but she possesses the move Decades of Experience which allows her to come up with useful knowledge whenever a PC consults her on something.  The PC gains +1 forward when acting on it, and she marks xp.  She is also extraordinarily insightful and perceptive (18 Wis) which augments all manner of stuff with a successful Discern Realities move.Long story short (too late!); in the crucible of GM framing, PC action declarations, and engagement with the resolution mechanics (which interface with extra-Int PC build components) will we find out if a PC has a legitimate claim to the Dread Pirate Roberts/Sherlock Holmes archetypes.The rest is social contract (again, this is sounding an awful lot like the "Paladin" social contract issue with a different coat of paint).</blockquote>

Verification