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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Bayuer" data-source="post: 4743764" data-attributes="member: 61817">Yeah. The style of play is irrelevant to discussion! At least someone undersood that.And this is my point. When I played on paragon I was hitted on 3-4 on die, couse my barb REF was low. I was playing on epic and even well optimized chars were hitted offten. Man. Empirical data <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> I didn't taken this from space. I did math after I saw epic monsters hit NADs too often and PHB2 feats came out. And why on earth you don't belive my math crunch? Make 25 level character, take some 25 artilery from MM and see it yourself. I'm not teacher to teach how to look if evidences are right or wrong. You didn't even do so little to make you opinion be supported. What are we talking here, about what mr. x feels about this topic or what are the facts?At first, thx for not answering again about some facts I did in previosu post. Maybe they was realy so strong, you couldn't answer. Anyway.Epic FRW gives +4 to singe. Robust Defenses +2 to all. So from hitting on 2 on die, he can hit if he rolls 6 on die (from my math on 30 lvl monster have +10 adventage to hit player where +0 is where he need to roll 10 to hit, so with +6 from feats he have +4 adventage thus he needs to roll 6 on die to hit). Thats much more diffrence than autohit. Chances are still weak to avoid being hitted but look at other defs. Your highest will be hitted now on 10 on die (not 8, couse you have Roboust Defenses feat). Your middle DEF will be hitted on 7 on die, 11 if you take Epic feat). I didn't take this numbers from vacum. If we fight agains artilery (my stats are for Skirmihser), situatuon is much worse, becouse artillery has +2 to hit compared to skirmihers. Do the math yourself. This feats are needed.So the math is broken or not? There are better ways to fix this. But we have PHB2 and this is the official fix. Fixing the PCs NADs is easier solution than, change every single monster power in MM. Even then we still have problems, becouse how make monster attacks compared to lowest NAD and highest NAD.1)When you will be autodominad/stunned etc. the game is less fun to you. You are completly eliminated from game and can't do nothing to make this stop. It's like 3E save or die ability, but your save is always failed.2)6 on die gives 30% chance of not being hitted, what gives you some hope. It's always better than autohit and makes the game more fair, more fun, more balanced. And it can be flawed now as "I'm clumsy and don't have god Reflex" better than "I'm clumsy just don't hit my REF couse I will have nothing to do on session". And one last thing, this feats aren't suppose to be feats. This is very bad fix, and should be incorporated to rules not as an option to PCs. Many of them will not even bother to see how the math works and what impact on game will have to not take this feats. That should never be an issue with well balanced game. Player whos not understand the math or don't want to get to numbers will sooner or later understand that this feats will make his character much better. Feat tax is always bad and that's way I make this thread.</blockquote>

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