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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Bayuer" data-source="post: 4759555" data-attributes="member: 61817">Ok you balanced them. But that just give us a strong example that when you try it, all your nads are being to hit on 3 on die, not one on 6 end other at lower. Do you realy can't see this? This makes things even worst for your character...You used feats... LOL! That means you will be hitted on 3 on 30 lvl instead of 2. All your NADs will be. Man. This is worst proof ever made. Don't you see that we are talking here about that this feats fix math. Add 3 epic feats to this and you will be hitted on 7. Now this is better but no good anyway. But you must spend 4(!) feats to maintain this... 3 +2 paragon feats earlier. Don't forget Expertise and probably armor/shield feats! Yeah man... They shouldn't gave us 18 feat if almost half of them must be spend to take must-have feats.I wasn't talking about secondary stats. I was talking about other stats. As an exampled Wizard. And when I was talking high I was talking about 12 in that stats. When you start with 16/16/13/11/10/8 (with is nice array enyway) you will have only 3 high stats and other are not important. There are some build than need 4 stats (or even 5). Not at 16 of course but for an example if you are playing Avenger (censure of retribution) and have high WIS and INT you probably will need DEX and CON to to have it at 12 at least. If you must use only 3 high stats (maybe that sounds fair) you lost customization of characters. If you make customization your NADs will suffer. That's not balance.<img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> Man. If you are using feats in you build, and that char is hitted on 5 with them... <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> That's just speak for itself. Oh, if you take amor feat! Wow. I forget that tax feat is another rule about 4E. You don't take feats you want. You take feats that make math workable...Let's se. Red Dragon have 4 powers that hit the NADs. 3 of them are blasts. 2 of them are recharge 5 (one blast)... Yeah, that's looking like no options for dragon to use. But if you want more monsters hitting NADs look at Dracolich. He have immdiate interupt power that stunns characters when he use melee attacks.I don't have to! Are you blind? 3 persons already told you that solos or elites don't have better attacks!Well there is a solo soldier at 30 lvl. Wow. He just pope up and showed at my MM. Miracle.Now we have a nice tool called Compendium, and we know that MM2 will be printed this month. Compendium shows 6 monsters that are 30 level. 4 more for you to look at them. And why you are still talking about normal monsters. Look at lower level monsters and they have sometimes more broken NADs attacks than this solos.Well look at Dracolich. Isn't enough? I understand. You need a monster at every level of epic tier that have at-will stunn attacks or saying about that isn't true. Well, use you MM. Lich 24lvl (recharg 5 stunn); Gibbering Orb (free action - dazes; I know it's not a stunn effects but it just look so nice). Aboleth Overseer (first daze, then dominate). I don't have time to convert MM now. This are just smaple monsters I faced.You balanced your NADs and the same lvl monster hit all you NADs on 5! Amazing. And I have another argument agains 'monster at higher levels sholud be more threatening'. They are. As you can see there are no normal monsters at higher levels. There are only elites and solos. That's it! Here is you proof that mosters power growes.And to be honest. If now add racial modifiers thats stats will go up to +8/+8/+7. Now you class can grant +2 to one your NADs. +10/+8/+7. Looks good isn't? Well of course it is. You just spend feat to boost your all NADs by 2! But here's the catch. This is 30 lvl build. You sit and make all numbers work. What is the situation on 20 lvl. Not so good. You'r weakes NAD is far far behind. But let's look at the chance of being hit by the Red Dragon... From hitted on 3 we now have hitted on 6, on 4 and on 3! WOW! <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" /> It's amaizing what you can do with a +2 feats this days. Let's add epic feats here. Hitted on 10, 8 and 7 now this is math I can say it is good! But I have spend 4 feats to boost NADs only. Balance is tricky thing <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></blockquote>

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