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<blockquote data-quote="RareBreed" data-source="post: 8920776" data-attributes="member: 6945590">The alignment system probably did not come into being whole cloth due to it being derived from a wargame.&nbsp; But I do feel like it became a quick litmus test of &quot;what am I allowed to kill to get experience and hoard it's treasure&quot;.I'd also challenge the notion of mass media having good and evil.&nbsp; Not challenge it in the sense that it's not true.&nbsp; We do definitely have that in mainstream media.&nbsp; What I mean by challenge is we have to be careful about defining what good and evil really are.&nbsp; And that's kind of my problem with &quot;good vs evil&quot; because it's too easy to make things black and white.The movie didn't quite do the comics justice, but the Avengers: Civil War movie was kind of a moral &quot;grey&quot; area, and why the heroes were fighting against each other.&nbsp; I'd even argue that what characterizes the Copper Age of comics is not just abandoning the &quot;Truth, Justice, and the American Way&quot; of the Golden/Silver ages, but&nbsp; having extremely popular characters who are anti-heroes&nbsp; (eg, Wolverine or the Punisher...and yeah I know, they are more Bronze Age than Copper, but I think their true popularity blossomed in the Copper Age).&nbsp; I think that most modern media entertainment nowadays even questions the whole notion of &quot;what is a good guy?&quot;.Or who is a bad guy for that matter.&nbsp; We see it now with characters like Dr. Doom who have become kinda-sorta &quot;good&quot; (debatable, but he's no longer unabashedly &quot;evil&quot;) or show casing the complexity of someone like Namor (both hero and nemesis of the air-breathers).&nbsp; Without giving away too many spoilers, look at the &quot;bad guys&quot; of Falcon and Winter Soldier TV series, or Wakanda Forever.&nbsp; I think people actually like that ambiguity, at least to some degree.&nbsp; It gives characters more depth and makes them far more interesting than slapping some label &quot;oh that's the bad guy, I am supposed to boo and hiss at him, and cheer on the good guy&quot;.I agree with you though; I think people should only make as much out of the alignment system as they want.&nbsp; I think it's something that should actually be addressed at the outset of a campaign too, because different players (especially if they are new and came from another gaming group) might have wildly different assumptions about how alignment works.&nbsp; But it's also why I'm not in favor of an alignment system in the game rules.&nbsp; It makes the rules seem &quot;official&quot; and less arbitrary and so, many players might have a perspective and understanding that is in line with how the rules present it.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="RareBreed, post: 8920776, member: 6945590"] The alignment system probably did not come into being whole cloth due to it being derived from a wargame. But I do feel like it became a quick litmus test of "what am I allowed to kill to get experience and hoard it's treasure". I'd also challenge the notion of mass media having good and evil. Not challenge it in the sense that it's not true. We do definitely have that in mainstream media. What I mean by [I]challenge[/I] is we have to be careful about defining what good and evil really are. And that's kind of my problem with "good vs evil" because it's too easy to make things black and white. The movie didn't quite do the comics justice, but the Avengers: Civil War movie was kind of a moral "grey" area, and why the heroes were fighting against each other. I'd even argue that what characterizes the Copper Age of comics is not just abandoning the "Truth, Justice, and the American Way" of the Golden/Silver ages, but having extremely popular characters who are anti-heroes (eg, Wolverine or the Punisher...and yeah I know, they are more Bronze Age than Copper, but I think their true popularity blossomed in the Copper Age). I think that most modern media entertainment nowadays even questions the whole notion of "what is a good guy?". Or who is a bad guy for that matter. We see it now with characters like Dr. Doom who have become kinda-sorta "good" (debatable, but he's no longer unabashedly "evil") or show casing the complexity of someone like Namor (both hero and nemesis of the air-breathers). Without giving away too many spoilers, look at the "bad guys" of Falcon and Winter Soldier TV series, or Wakanda Forever. I think people actually like that ambiguity, at least to some degree. It gives characters more depth and makes them far more interesting than slapping some label "oh that's the bad guy, I am supposed to boo and hiss at him, and cheer on the [I]good[/I] guy". I agree with you though; I think people should only make as much out of the alignment system as they want. I think it's something that should actually be addressed at the outset of a campaign too, because different players (especially if they are new and came from another gaming group) might have wildly different assumptions about how alignment works. But it's also why I'm not in favor of an alignment system in the game rules. It makes the rules seem "official" and less arbitrary and so, many players might have a perspective and understanding that is in line with how the rules present it. [/QUOTE]

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