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Message: <blockquote data-quote="infax" data-source="post: 3963248" data-attributes="member: 12784">With combat spells and utility spells getting more segregated in 4e, I'm guessing we'll have two kinds of Charm spells.One Charm spell will be mostly useful out of combat, adding a bonus to diplomacy and deception checks, I guess and tying in nicely with the social encounter rules. Something like the Jump spell for social encounters - as Silvergriffon suggested. Although I hope it won't be that great a bonus as the +10 bonus Jump provided. Otherwise it would greatly diminish the shine of those characters investing in the skill.Another would be a kind of combat charm. The purpose would be to take a creature out of combat and something dazed or slightly friendly once combat is over. I would guess, as other posters, that it would take several rounds to take full effect, however, I'd prefer it had immediate consequences for each failed check as Poison or Petrification seem to be going to work. Something like a "Command" for every successful attack against save would be appropriate. After 3-5 successful attacks against Will, the subject would be fully charmed. I'm not sure if I would prefer this to be a fire and forget type of spell or if it would require repeated uses. I guess fire and forget would be better than giving the Wizard this spell At Will (something that could be reserved for the Psion or an hypothetical Enchanter class).Getting the target to act in combat, however, would be something reserved for Domination or Enthrallment spells, I think.</blockquote>

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