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<blockquote data-quote="DEFCON 1" data-source="post: 6559088" data-attributes="member: 7006">I wouldn't be at all shocked that if at the time of 4E's release... he and the others might've genuinely thought it was fastest due simply to knowledge they already had of how the game plays, and how explicit each facet of combat was (without the need for DM adjudication or looking stuff up/making rulings, which often leads to arguments/discussions at the table of how things should play out.)If they were all masters of the game, I could certainly see the table during combat where each of them had all their powers printed out and configured for easy reference, during the game already figured out their turns beforehand on other player's turns, made their mini move/attack on their turn quickly, and then moved onto the next person.&nbsp; With only the first set of books available to them (and thus much less complicated additional rules that came in with other classes and such), he could genuinely think he was telling the truth.Of course... then the reality set in of all the players who WEREN'T that organized / up on the rules / not willing to puzzle out the &quot;optimum&quot; strategy for themselves each and every turn, and DMs who were the same way.&nbsp; The game then did slooooooooow down for many tables, rendering Mike's beliefs ultimately incorrect.&nbsp; So I wouldn't say he was deliberately lying to anyone... he might've just been blinded to the faults due to his own experiences.*EDITED TO ADD*Let's also not forget that he might've been thinking of 4E's initial speed when compared to 3.5... but not initial core book 3.5, but the Frankenstein's Monster of 3.5 once all the extra additional material and splat stuff got incorporated that he had built into his game.&nbsp; That's probably the last part of 3.5 he remembered, and yeah, I could see basic 4E running faster than that stuff.&nbsp; I think ANY edition's initial gameplay with just the three core books runs easier and faster than any version that has several years of splats merged into it.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="DEFCON 1, post: 6559088, member: 7006"] I wouldn't be at all shocked that if at the time of 4E's release... he and the others might've genuinely thought it was fastest due simply to knowledge they already had of how the game plays, and how explicit each facet of combat was (without the need for DM adjudication or looking stuff up/making rulings, which often leads to arguments/discussions at the table of how things should play out.) If they were all masters of the game, I could certainly see the table during combat where each of them had all their powers printed out and configured for easy reference, during the game already figured out their turns beforehand on other player's turns, made their mini move/attack on their turn quickly, and then moved onto the next person. With only the first set of books available to them (and thus much less complicated additional rules that came in with other classes and such), he could genuinely think he was telling the truth. Of course... then the reality set in of all the players who WEREN'T that organized / up on the rules / not willing to puzzle out the "optimum" strategy for themselves each and every turn, and DMs who were the same way. The game then did slooooooooow down for many tables, rendering Mike's beliefs ultimately incorrect. So I wouldn't say he was deliberately lying to anyone... he might've just been blinded to the faults due to his own experiences. *EDITED TO ADD* Let's also not forget that he might've been thinking of 4E's initial speed when compared to 3.5... but not [i]initial[/i] core book 3.5, but the Frankenstein's Monster of 3.5 once all the extra additional material and splat stuff got incorporated that he had built into his game. That's probably the last part of 3.5 he remembered, and yeah, I could see basic 4E running faster than that stuff. I think ANY edition's initial gameplay with just the three core books runs easier and faster than any version that has several years of splats merged into it. [/QUOTE]

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