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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Tony Vargas" data-source="post: 6888344" data-attributes="member: 996">There have been a few sub-classes that use CS dice in UA, in a few more-specific ways than maneuvers (that aren't actually maneuvers that might expand the BM's repetoir).  And, the BM-style maneuvers are a very limited design space, anyway, since they have to squeeze in the limited wiggle-room left by the fighter's heavy focus on multi-attacking DPR.  There's really not a lot more to be done with the fighter, especially given the way it's been approached in SCAG & UA.  I'd suggest otherwise.  It might be worth a peek, but it's essentially an on-line slush pile.  As a player, don't bother sifting through it to find something you might like, since the chances you can find a DM who found/liked the same thing is pretty slight.  As a DM, though, it could be a handy resource.  Thus "DM's Guild," no doubt.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />Meh.  Real life is full of things your average D&D-playing nerd has no experience of.  Combat to the death with medieval weapons (or any weapons, or no weapons) being only one of them.  As far as second-hand experience via genre tropes, sure, but we have that for magic, as well.  Magic has more push-button/'broken'/detailed/whatever sub-systems because: tradition.  It's not required.  There are plenty of games, including one edition of D&D, that didn't give non-caster short shrift.  It all depends on the tone the game goes for.  A game like Ars Magicka is tilted way over in favor of casters, with non-casters ('Grogs') explicitly relegated to second-class-PC (if they're PCs at all) status, while, conversely, a game like Iron Heroes had only 1 caster class, and it wasn't even necessarily an option, and, other games strike more of a balance Hero System's 'powers' could be used with equal facility to build magical, non-magical, technological, mutant abilities and anything else you could think of.Didn't seem /that/ passive. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />  And, all the negativity towards DoaM was very much "sniping at other gamers who play differently."  To be clear, the BM isn't anything like a 'complex fighter' or warlord, it's still deadly dull and simplistic by the standards of fans who want more depth in their PC options.  It's just that there's /plenty/ of such complexity everywhere else.  You just have to be a little flexible about what kind of concept you play.Hyperbole is rarely productive.  Sometimes it makes a point. Sometimes it's just funny.  "Grognard appeasement ritual" was kinda funny, and it did make a point, not about either side of the DoaM furor, or about WotC's decision on that topic, but about the long-standing bi-polar issue D&D and it's community have had with the fighter ('most popular class,' yet 'can't have nice things').</blockquote>

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