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So what's exactly wrong with the fighter?
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<blockquote data-quote="Blue" data-source="post: 6655214" data-attributes="member: 20564"><p>The fighter is the only class who gets more feats. You can spend those feats on making a hyper-DPR combatant and many do. But Fighter holds up it's combat relevance without spending more feats on it than other classes do, so those feats can also be used for the utility/exploration needs that are often overlooked.</p><p></p><p>For example Actor opens up whole lines of play, and it's always on. No need to use up limited spell slot resources, or to have to deal with the backlash of the duration ending on Friends.</p><p></p><p>Let's get this out of the way - I'm not saying the fighter is "tier one" utility like the Wizard. Most classes aren't. But it stands in the same neighborhood as the pack and it's better then some.</p><p></p><p>Just like the sorcerer could only know fireball and other direct damage spells, the fighter could spend all of his feats on combat. And both would be very good at one thing. But the class gives you more options than that, you just need to take them.</p><p></p><p>(Okay, a fighter in a non-feat game will have fantastic stats, but will be gimped in exploration/utility.)</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>True of any primarily melee class. Paladins have little ranged attack spells, no innate fly, and smite only works on melee attacks. I'd have to say they are in a worse place then a melee fighter. </p><p></p><p>Plus you can do an archer archetype quite well with the Fighter. You definitely experienced a pain point for melee combatants, but (a) not restricted to the fighter and (b) only applicable to some fighter builds.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Start with all weapons and armors and good HPs. Not glamorous but important. Second Wind takes that further. The 1st level fighter is probably the toughest character, with similar effective HPs over a day then the barbarian (who can only rage twice vs. action surge 3 times with the suggested 2 short rests) and a much better AC. Barbarian will pass him, especially bear totem, but while they are getting defensive features like that he's getting offensive features:</p><p></p><p>2nd level give Action Surge, a powerful ability, enough so that many multiclass guides mention going into fighter just for this.</p><p></p><p>3rd level gives superiority dice, critical, or spells.</p><p></p><p>6th gives the first extra feat/ASI that others don't get.</p><p></p><p>I'd say it's on par. I'm sure someone could cherry pick a class that does really good 1-10, but if you look at them vs. all of the other classes I don't find them to be falling behind the pack at levels 1-10.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Blue, post: 6655214, member: 20564"] The fighter is the only class who gets more feats. You can spend those feats on making a hyper-DPR combatant and many do. But Fighter holds up it's combat relevance without spending more feats on it than other classes do, so those feats can also be used for the utility/exploration needs that are often overlooked. For example Actor opens up whole lines of play, and it's always on. No need to use up limited spell slot resources, or to have to deal with the backlash of the duration ending on Friends. Let's get this out of the way - I'm not saying the fighter is "tier one" utility like the Wizard. Most classes aren't. But it stands in the same neighborhood as the pack and it's better then some. Just like the sorcerer could only know fireball and other direct damage spells, the fighter could spend all of his feats on combat. And both would be very good at one thing. But the class gives you more options than that, you just need to take them. (Okay, a fighter in a non-feat game will have fantastic stats, but will be gimped in exploration/utility.) True of any primarily melee class. Paladins have little ranged attack spells, no innate fly, and smite only works on melee attacks. I'd have to say they are in a worse place then a melee fighter. Plus you can do an archer archetype quite well with the Fighter. You definitely experienced a pain point for melee combatants, but (a) not restricted to the fighter and (b) only applicable to some fighter builds. Start with all weapons and armors and good HPs. Not glamorous but important. Second Wind takes that further. The 1st level fighter is probably the toughest character, with similar effective HPs over a day then the barbarian (who can only rage twice vs. action surge 3 times with the suggested 2 short rests) and a much better AC. Barbarian will pass him, especially bear totem, but while they are getting defensive features like that he's getting offensive features: 2nd level give Action Surge, a powerful ability, enough so that many multiclass guides mention going into fighter just for this. 3rd level gives superiority dice, critical, or spells. 6th gives the first extra feat/ASI that others don't get. I'd say it's on par. I'm sure someone could cherry pick a class that does really good 1-10, but if you look at them vs. all of the other classes I don't find them to be falling behind the pack at levels 1-10. [/QUOTE]
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So what's exactly wrong with the fighter?
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