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<blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 6663302" data-attributes="member: 22779">[MENTION=5834]Celtavian[/MENTION] - never play Pathfinder for the same reason I stopped playing 3e. Not interested in spending hours doing the math or needing a spreadsheet program to play. There's a reason it's nicknamed Mathfinder. &nbsp;[MENTION=6787650]Hemlock[/MENTION] you are the one who brought up dissociated mechanics and said you don't want to see them in the game. What motive am I missing here?&nbsp; How is the fighter aware that he has a Second Wind?&nbsp; Where does it say that?&nbsp; How, exactly does the fighter trigger it in game?&nbsp; The only reason it bothers me is that you got what you want. You got exactly what you wanted. But if an optional class comes out, that will turn you off the game?&nbsp; Really?&nbsp; Someone having the option of a 4e style character in 5e will cause you to stop playing, even if it's never played at your table?I'm not asking for a whole bunch. I'm asking for one subclass. Again, I'm answering the question asked. I want a non-magical character that is roughly equal to a caster in complexity. Going back to 3e isn't an option for me. That's too much complexity. Never minding the imbalance in the system between casters and non-casters. That's a separate issue. Why is having the option for a complex fighter so threatening?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Hussar, post: 6663302, member: 22779"] [MENTION=5834]Celtavian[/MENTION] - never play Pathfinder for the same reason I stopped playing 3e. Not interested in spending hours doing the math or needing a spreadsheet program to play. There's a reason it's nicknamed Mathfinder. [MENTION=6787650]Hemlock[/MENTION] you are the one who brought up dissociated mechanics and said you don't want to see them in the game. What motive am I missing here? How is the fighter aware that he has a Second Wind? Where does it say that? How, exactly does the fighter trigger it in game? The only reason it bothers me is that you got what you want. You got exactly what you wanted. But if an optional class comes out, that will turn you off the game? Really? Someone having the option of a 4e style character in 5e will cause you to stop playing, even if it's never played at your table? I'm not asking for a whole bunch. I'm asking for one subclass. Again, I'm answering the question asked. I want a non-magical character that is roughly equal to a caster in complexity. Going back to 3e isn't an option for me. That's too much complexity. Never minding the imbalance in the system between casters and non-casters. That's a separate issue. Why is having the option for a complex fighter so threatening? [/QUOTE]

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