Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="Sacrosanct" data-source="post: 6663435" data-attributes="member: 15700">We tend to base our PCs in the game as examples of the exceptional people, and not a typical random person.&nbsp; For real world comparisons, we have hundreds of &quot;real world&quot; examples of people living through wounds that would kill most everyone else.&nbsp; Besides, it's a fallacy to say that &quot;a sword can kill a person in real life in a single strike, but not a PC in the game, therefore the PC should be able to completely bend reality in the game too by doing all of these superpower maneuvers.&quot;I can't speak for anyone else, but I will speak for me and try to re-explain why I have a problem with all these power options.&nbsp; It's largely two-fold1. The disassociation makes absolutely no sense.&nbsp; Look at the &quot;crack the shell&quot; from the earlier discussion.&nbsp; Hussar said he wanted to do an attack that also sundered armor.&nbsp; But since it didn't exist as a power in AD&amp;D, &quot;there was no way it would fly&quot; and he &quot;can't do it&quot;, but in 4e, it's &quot;easy peasy&quot; because there's a power for it.&nbsp; Yeah, a 5th level fighter daily.&nbsp; Meaning that if Hussar wanted to make an attack that sundered armor, he would only do it once per day, and only as a 5th or higher level fighter.&nbsp; That makes ZERO sense.&nbsp; That's like saying, &quot;I want to perform a maneuver in basketball called a 'dunk'&quot;, but you can only do it once per game.&nbsp; In that earlier discussion, in AD&amp;D, anyone could attempt to render armor any time they want.&nbsp; But it is a maneuver that is handled in the context of what's going on at the time.&nbsp; It's associated with the game context.This is what I call the &quot;if it's not written as a power then the class doesn't have options&quot; fallacy that folks like yourself keep trying to make.&nbsp; How many times just in the past couple days in this thread alone has someone complained about the fighter not having options when they do, just not written down in the class as a power?2. The &quot;maneuvers&quot; themselves go into superpower territory because you can use them, automatically, even when they make no sense.&nbsp; Like tripping a slime.&nbsp; Or pulling a &quot;Get Over Here&quot; to pretty much any type of monster when it can make no sense whatsoever. Other issues people have with the laundry list of options is that they don't want every class to have a list of things to keep track of or to do resource management with.&nbsp; This may be a big shock, but a lot of people don't like Marvel Super Hero D&amp;D.&nbsp; They want a class that is streamlined.&nbsp; If they wanted a class with a list of powers, they'd play a class that had a list of powers</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Sacrosanct, post: 6663435, member: 15700"] We tend to base our PCs in the game as examples of the exceptional people, and not a typical random person. For real world comparisons, we have hundreds of "real world" examples of people living through wounds that would kill most everyone else. Besides, it's a fallacy to say that "a sword can kill a person in real life in a single strike, but not a PC in the game, therefore the PC should be able to completely bend reality in the game too by doing all of these superpower maneuvers." I can't speak for anyone else, but I will speak for me and try to re-explain why I have a problem with all these power options. It's largely two-fold 1. The disassociation makes absolutely no sense. Look at the "crack the shell" from the earlier discussion. Hussar said he wanted to do an attack that also sundered armor. But since it didn't exist as a power in AD&D, "there was no way it would fly" and he "can't do it", but in 4e, it's "easy peasy" because there's a power for it. Yeah, a 5th level fighter daily. Meaning that if Hussar wanted to make an attack that sundered armor, he would only do it once per day, and only as a 5th or higher level fighter. That makes ZERO sense. That's like saying, "I want to perform a maneuver in basketball called a 'dunk'", but you can only do it once per game. In that earlier discussion, in AD&D, [i]anyone[/i] could attempt to render armor [i]any time they want[/i]. But it is a maneuver that is handled in the context of what's going on at the time. It's [i]associated[/i] with the game context. This is what I call the "if it's not written as a power then the class doesn't have options" fallacy that folks like yourself keep trying to make. How many times just in the past couple days in this thread alone has someone complained about the fighter not having options when they do, just not written down in the class as a power? 2. The "maneuvers" themselves go into superpower territory because you can use them, automatically, even when they make no sense. Like tripping a slime. Or pulling a "Get Over Here" to pretty much any type of monster when it can make no sense whatsoever. Other issues people have with the laundry list of options is that they don't want every class to have a list of things to keep track of or to do resource management with. This may be a big shock, but a lot of people don't like Marvel Super Hero D&D. They want a class that is streamlined. If they wanted a class with a list of powers, they'd play a class that had a list of powers [/QUOTE]

Verification