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<blockquote data-quote="Minigiant" data-source="post: 6664358" data-attributes="member: 63508">The problem is the this whole question is argued form the wrong angle. This is why this whole thread exists.If you let magic classes have disassociative mechanics and excuse them because magic but then deny the mundane classes dissassociative mechanics when everyone doesn't agree on, will most of the fans see the mundane class as fun and customizable?And this thread says, no.The 5th ed fighter can only be build to tank or deal tons of damage. It can do skills and checks but not as good as any other so it often finds it being a slot filler (the athlete when there's no STR PC, the face when there's no CHA class). Being special require player effort, group coordination, and DM allowance.We, D&amp;D fans, cannot have it both ways.We cannot say &quot;don't force things on the fighter. It must have different options&quot;, then always pick the same options and complain about the lack of options.We cannot deny the fighter many options via complaints then say the fighter has no options via later complaints. You can't say the fighter cannot be mythical or magical then complain that all it can do it bash brains and block hits</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Minigiant, post: 6664358, member: 63508"] The problem is the this whole question is argued form the wrong angle. This is why this whole thread exists. If you let magic classes have disassociative mechanics and excuse them because magic but then deny the mundane classes dissassociative mechanics when everyone doesn't agree on, will most of the fans see the mundane class as fun and customizable? And this thread says, no. The 5th ed fighter can only be build to tank or deal tons of damage. It can do skills and checks but not as good as any other so it often finds it being a slot filler (the athlete when there's no STR PC, the face when there's no CHA class). Being special require player effort, group coordination, and DM allowance. We, D&D fans, cannot have it both ways. We cannot say "don't force things on the fighter. It must have different options", then always pick the same options and complain about the lack of options. We cannot deny the fighter many options via complaints then say the fighter has no options via later complaints. You can't say the fighter cannot be mythical or magical then complain that all it can do it bash brains and block hits [/QUOTE]

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