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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Wulffolk" data-source="post: 7266550" data-attributes="member: 6871450">[MENTION=6775031]Saelorn[/MENTION]If you are basing your argument on math, then you must know that it is flawed when you claim that Joe would be 0% more effective than Larry 95% of the time.Let us assume that both started with a 15 Strength and a 10 in Wisdom.Both are likely to bump their Strength to 16 at the first opportunity, which costs 3 points. That is achievable at 6th level.Larry chooses to hold that extra point for further Strength increases. To get to 18 would cost him 7 more points, for a total of 10. He could hit 18 Strength at 14th level.Now Joe chooses to improve his willpower by increasing Wisdom. He can spend 2 point to get 12 at 6th level. It will take him 3 more points to get to 14, which could be done by 12th level. That is a +2 to Wisdom saves and Ability checks 2 levels before Larry even gets +1 more modifier to his Strength.Let's say they both needed to make a DC 15 Wisdom say against a spell that would incapacitate them. That +2 bonus that Joe has means that he would be 100% more effective than Larry 40% more often. That is not insignificant.If the DM is only placing challenges before Larry and Joe that require them to swing a sword, then after hitting 14th level Larry will be slightly more effective. If the DM utilizes any level of creativity or imagination to reward Joe for being more than one-dimensional then Joe will outshine Larry for the majority of his career, especially through the mid-levels.That is only taking Ability increases into account. If Bob were to take Feats instead of Ability increases then he would have 3 more nifty tricks or tactics or interesting aspects to his character before Larry even got that +1 extra modifier.The path to "power" is still open to Larry, but at a cost. I think this is a step in the right direction for encouraging diversity in builds and reducing clones. I don't think that every player would choose the same path, given those options.In the end it comes down to the DM. The game only actively punishes or rewards any particular build when the DM decides that it does.</blockquote>

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