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<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 8197221" data-attributes="member: 42582">Right. The claim that system matters isn't a claim about what anyone should care about, or spend their time on.It's a claim about necessary conditions of particular experiences. In particular, if you want an experience different from GM-driven storytelling, there are ways to do that but they will require different processes of play and perhaps also different resolution techniques from those you've been using.Agreed. Once you move away from GM-driven storytelling/railroading, there are different ways to establish the shared fiction via player decision-making. And there are both procedures and techniques that are at odds with that (just as, as you note, there are procedures and techniques that will impede GM-storytelling).It's not a coincidence that RPGers who want to make that move are the ones who have noticed that system matters, because the default approach to RPGing at least since the early-to-mid-80s has been GM-driven storytelling. So of course for those who want that, there has never been much need to think about system.Right. What you say in these posts fits with chaochou's post: the systems you mention (PbtA, BW, DitV) are precisely the &quot;rarer ones&quot; which don't support GM-driven storytelling.When those who are comfortable with the default encounter those &quot;rarer&quot; systems then they suddenly discover that system does matter to the play experience: and frankly you can see that encounter happening in thread after thread on these boards. In the same way, those who want play experiences different from the &quot;mainstream&quot; need to change their system to change their experience. There is zero chance, playing 5e D&amp;D (to pick a prominent &quot;mainstream&quot; RPG), of getting the sort of experience I have when I play Burning Wheel.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 8197221, member: 42582"] Right. The claim that [I]system matters[/I] isn't a claim about what anyone should care about, or spend their time on. It's a claim about [I]necessary conditions of particular experiences[/I]. In particular, if you want an experience different from GM-driven storytelling, [I]there are ways to do that but they will require different processes of play and perhaps also different resolution techniques[/I] from those you've been using. Agreed. Once you move away from GM-driven storytelling/railroading, there are different ways to establish the shared fiction via player decision-making. And there are both procedures and techniques that are at odds with that (just as, as you note, there are procedures and techniques that will impede GM-storytelling). It's not a coincidence that RPGers who want to make that move are the ones who have noticed that system matters, because the default approach to RPGing at least since the early-to-mid-80s has been GM-driven storytelling. So of course for those who want that, there has never been much need to think about system. Right. What you say in these posts fits with chaochou's post: the systems you mention (PbtA, BW, DitV) are precisely the "rarer ones" which don't support GM-driven storytelling. When those who are comfortable with the default encounter those "rarer" systems then they suddenly discover that system [I]does[/I] matter to the play experience: and frankly you can see that encounter happening in thread after thread on these boards. In the same way, those who want play experiences different from the "mainstream" need to change their system to change their experience. There is zero chance, playing 5e D&D (to pick a prominent "mainstream" RPG), of getting the sort of experience I have when I play Burning Wheel. [/QUOTE]

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