Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Some spells _really_ powerful?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="doctorhook" data-source="post: 6369069" data-attributes="member: 58401"><p>Spells are supposed to be powerful, aren't they?</p><p><em>Fireball</em> has always been a big hitter; dropping one of these <strong>should</strong> be a serious threat to a 5th-level party. Similarly, it should also represent a significant expenditure of resources to a 5th-level wizard, and it does. At 5th level, a wizard can only cast this twice per day.</p><p></p><p><em>Sleep</em> gets weaker as the party levels up, just as it did in previous editions. At 1st level, it's pretty amazing, but even by 5th level you'll be lucky to have it affect more than one same-level enemy; casting it with a higher level spell-slot will provide sharply diminishing returns.</p><p></p><p>Unfortunately I don't have my PH with me, so I don't know offhand what <em>armor of Agathys</em> does, but doesn't it depend on the warlock being damaged in melee? I have no doubt the spell is powerful, but if I'm remembering correctly, that's a huge limitation.</p><p></p><p>At any rate, casters are likely to be more powerful in 5E than non-casters; that's part of D&D's history, and part of why pretty much every class has magical options. Fortunately still, 5E was designed with clever limitations: bounded accuracy on stats, severely reduced numbers of high-level spell slots per day, and a hard limit on buffs thanks to concentration rules. Overall, I don't think you should worry.</p><p></p><p>But the rogue can do that all day (and attack with advantage, too) potentially without being noticed, while the sorcerer is eventually bound to run out of spell slots and spell points all while attracting the attention of everyone who sees him.</p><p></p><p>If you're finding that your sorcerer is nova-ing too much, try putting more pressure on the party so that the casters aren't always able to stay fully rested.</p><p></p><p>Casting fireball with higher-level spell slots (like in the example above) is worse damage-wise than just using that slot to cast a higher-level damage spell, but using a 6th-level slot to cast <em>magic missile</em> or <em>inflict wounds</em> is honestly a huge waste. Yep, if you're willing to burn your only 6th-level spell slot to cast a <em>super-duper magic missile</em>, it ought to be better than a cantrip, but the numbers you provided show that it's only barely better even including the fact that it auto-hits. </p><p></p><p>Cantrips are meant to stand-in for weapon attacks for spellcasters, so they ought to be roughly on-par with (or perhaps only slightly worse than) what non-casters can do with basic weapon attacks.</p><p></p><p>Overall, I definitely believe you should put more encounters on the party during each day. For example, if the party is crawling through the Redbrand hideout (Lost Mine of Phandelver), they shouldn't be able to take more than one short rest in that whole dungeon before the BBEG escapes and all the enemies start scouring the place for the party that's infiltrated them; if the party does any fighting down there and then leaves for a long rest, when they return the base should be either abandoned (and most of the treasure already taken) or completely fortified against another incursion. This should be true for almost any dungeon on intelligent creatures.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="doctorhook, post: 6369069, member: 58401"] Spells are supposed to be powerful, aren't they? [I]Fireball[/I] has always been a big hitter; dropping one of these [b]should[/b] be a serious threat to a 5th-level party. Similarly, it should also represent a significant expenditure of resources to a 5th-level wizard, and it does. At 5th level, a wizard can only cast this twice per day. [I]Sleep[/I] gets weaker as the party levels up, just as it did in previous editions. At 1st level, it's pretty amazing, but even by 5th level you'll be lucky to have it affect more than one same-level enemy; casting it with a higher level spell-slot will provide sharply diminishing returns. Unfortunately I don't have my PH with me, so I don't know offhand what [I]armor of Agathys[/I] does, but doesn't it depend on the warlock being damaged in melee? I have no doubt the spell is powerful, but if I'm remembering correctly, that's a huge limitation. At any rate, casters are likely to be more powerful in 5E than non-casters; that's part of D&D's history, and part of why pretty much every class has magical options. Fortunately still, 5E was designed with clever limitations: bounded accuracy on stats, severely reduced numbers of high-level spell slots per day, and a hard limit on buffs thanks to concentration rules. Overall, I don't think you should worry. But the rogue can do that all day (and attack with advantage, too) potentially without being noticed, while the sorcerer is eventually bound to run out of spell slots and spell points all while attracting the attention of everyone who sees him. If you're finding that your sorcerer is nova-ing too much, try putting more pressure on the party so that the casters aren't always able to stay fully rested. Casting fireball with higher-level spell slots (like in the example above) is worse damage-wise than just using that slot to cast a higher-level damage spell, but using a 6th-level slot to cast [I]magic missile[/I] or [I]inflict wounds[/I] is honestly a huge waste. Yep, if you're willing to burn your only 6th-level spell slot to cast a [I]super-duper magic missile[/I], it ought to be better than a cantrip, but the numbers you provided show that it's only barely better even including the fact that it auto-hits. Cantrips are meant to stand-in for weapon attacks for spellcasters, so they ought to be roughly on-par with (or perhaps only slightly worse than) what non-casters can do with basic weapon attacks. Overall, I definitely believe you should put more encounters on the party during each day. For example, if the party is crawling through the Redbrand hideout (Lost Mine of Phandelver), they shouldn't be able to take more than one short rest in that whole dungeon before the BBEG escapes and all the enemies start scouring the place for the party that's infiltrated them; if the party does any fighting down there and then leaves for a long rest, when they return the base should be either abandoned (and most of the treasure already taken) or completely fortified against another incursion. This should be true for almost any dungeon on intelligent creatures. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Some spells _really_ powerful?
Top